What is an "action RPG"?

[ZedClampet]

What counts as an action RPG anyway?

Are you a strict Diablo-ist or do you have a more freewheeling "it's an RPG with action in it" kind of definition?

www.pcgamer.com

From the PCG story: Imagine an alignment diagram. On one extreme you have people who consider action RPG to mean purely Diablo-style stuff because they grew up playing PC games and needed a phrase that meant "not Ultima". On the other extreme you have people who grew up playing console games and use action RPG to describe things that are more Zelda-like, because they needed a shorthand for "not Final Fantasy".

I've changed over the years on this. I used to be a strict "Action RPG means Diablo-like" but now I use it to mean an RPG that isn't either turn-based or real-time with pause.

So what do you mean when you say, "Action RPG"?

 

[January's Ghost]

Any RPG that requires a good deal of my own personal reflexes.

If I have to manually aim a bow and adjust for timing and distance to make the shot.
If I have to manually press a button to block, especially if I get a particular bonus for blocking at just the right time.
If I have to time an incoming attack and press a button to dodge.
If combat is based on constant movement and positioning in real time.

This would make Skyrim an action RPG .

 

[Pifanjr]

Any RPG that requires a good deal of my own personal reflexes.

If I have to manually aim a bow and adjust for timing and distance to make the shot.
If I have to manually press a button to block, especially if I get a particular bonus for blocking at just the right time.
If I have to time an incoming attack and press a button to dodge.
If combat is based on constant movement and positioning in real time.

This would make Skyrim an action RPG .

Would you consider Undertale an action RPG?

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Would you consider Undertale an action RPG?

Undertale is a JRPG like Dark Souls or Dragons Dogma.... No wait...

Like I said in the other thread in my head canon an ARPG (Diablo like) is different from an Action RPG(Dark Souls). Also JRPGS dont all come from Japan or even Asia, and the term RPG on its own doesnt mean anything much anymore the umbrella is so wide.

ARPG always meant Diablo Like to me, its only in the last 10-15 years where almost all games have started to have RPG elements in them that Ive even become aware of the term Action RPG as a non acronym. I wouldnt have called Dark Souls or the new God of War any kind of RPG if they were made back in 2005, theyre just Character Action games with more deliberate slower paced combat.

Genre terms are a mess.

 

[Colif]

as stated elsewhere, ARPG & Action RPG are strangely two different types of games.

Its all dumb. RPG is worse still. Mario is not an RPG and yet... it is.

As long as the people who enjoy them know what to buy, who cares?

 

[ZedClampet]

As long as the people who enjoy them know what to buy, who cares?

This is a problem if, like me, you often search Steam by tags. You just get all sorts of unrelated stuff in these tags. And what is Pillars of Eternity 2? Is it still an aRPG even though it doesn't have Diablo-like combat anymore?

Undertale is a JRPG like Dark Souls or Dragons Dogma.... No wait...

People really are using that this way on occasion, which makes the term completely useless. If you don't have terrible dialogue and turn-based combat (and usually anime characters), you can't be a JRPG.

The most important thing about a JRPG, though, is that the characters get in a line for combat.

Expedition 33 doesn't have anime characters or terrible dialogue (apparently). It's not made in Japan. It's getting called a JRPG strictly because of how its turn-based combat is arranged on the screen. If everyone didn't line up side-by-side for combat, would anyone call it a JRPG?

Darkest Dungeon could be a JRPG but the line forms in the wrong direction.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Its all dumb. RPG is worse still. Mario is not an RPG and yet... it is.

Mario RPG is an RPG, as is Paper Mario and, Mario Golf: Advance Tour? Easy when you see it.

This is a problem if, like me, you often search Steam by tags. You just get all sorts of unrelated stuff in these tags. And what is Pillars of Eternity 2? Is it still an aRPG even though it doesn't have Diablo-like combat anymore?

Its an Isometric Party Based Western RPG, or an Infinity Engine clone. Not any kind of ARPG IMO. The combat is either turn based or RTWP, so it cant be considered action based if youre pausing and considering anything.

People really are using that this way on occasion, which makes the term completely useless. If you don't have terrible dialogue and turn-based combat (and usually anime characters), you can't be a JRPG.

The most important thing about a JRPG, though, is that the characters get in a line for combat.

Expedition 33 doesn't have anime characters or terrible dialogue (apparently). It's not made in Japan. It's getting called a JRPG strictly because of how its turn-based combat is arranged on the screen. If everyone didn't line up side-by-side for combat, would anyone call it a JRPG?

Darkest Dungeon could be a JRPG but the line forms in the wrong direction.

Havent played a lot of JRPGs but arent they mostly kind of linear and story heavy? I know there can be a lot of grinding, but I was under the impression it was mostly in between compulsory story beats and there wasn't much freedom normally narratively. The only one Ive played in recent years is Ni No Kuni so I dont really know.

I'm tempted to try Metaphor: Refantazio when its a bit cheaper. Not sure if Atlus games fit the same rough mold as Final Fantasy or not.

 

[ZedClampet]

Mario RPG is an RPG, as is Paper Mario and, Mario Golf: Advance Tour? Easy when you see it.


Its an Isometric Party Based Western RPG, or an Infinity Engine clone. Not any kind of ARPG IMO. The combat is either turn based or RTWP, so it cant be considered action based if youre pausing and considering anything.

Ugh, I meant Path of Exile 2, not Pillars...I know what Pillars is. Sorry

 

[Colif]

lol. Game names have same initials is almost as bad as genres having the same initials

MW2 is another one, is it Modern Warfare 2 or Mech Warrior 2? Yes

I don't know answer to POE2 as it seems it changes depending on the season. It appears it has been known to be a rogue like in some seasons, or other games in others. That is POE anyway, the 2nd one is still in early access.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Ugh, I meant Path of Exile 2, not Pillars...I know what Pillars is. Sorry

Ah I should have known.

 

[Rataplan]

The term rpg has changed over the years. The very first rpg´s were purely text based story´s where you had to make choices that impacted the way the story coninued.

 

[Colif]

The term rpg has changed over the years. The very first rpg´s were purely text based story´s where you had to make choices that impacted the way the story coninued.

Zork: The Great Underground Empire game at DOSGames.com

Zork: The Great Underground Empire is a seminal interactive fiction game, and the first in a series of influential text adventure games from Infocom. ...

dosgames.com

 

[Frindis]

ARPG & Action RPG: For me, it is the same thing as Diablo 2, Path of Exile, Titan Quest, Last Epoch, Torchlight, etc..
RPG: Everything else. Assassin Creed, Dark Souls, Skyrim, Wukong, Tsushima, Fallout, Elden Ring, Morrowind, etc..

lol. Game names have same initials is almost as bad as genres having the same initials

MW2 is another one, is it Modern Warfare 2 or Mech Warrior 2? Yes

I think it depends on who has been known for it/who started it first and their popularity marketing-wise. Like if you ask people what MW2 stands for, the majority will say Modern Warfare 2. If you make an indie game and try to sell it talking about MW2, nobody is going to understand what you mean. It is a household name in a sense.

 

[Colif]

Yeah, POE 2 is a better example. More recent games anyway.

 

[DXCHASE]

I agree with some of the summations. Honestly if i ever talk to someone about RPG games and ask if they like "ARPGs" and they go "whats that" ill always say "games like diablo". Then they usually go "whats that" and we just move on.

I think what makes an ARPG to me, is the way the game looks perspective wise like ARPGs always being a top-down view you can zoom in on. If its 3rd person or 1st, it usually winds up being classified as something else, not specifically ARPG.

You cant do that with games like Diablo, Path of Exile, Grim Dawn, Lost Ark, Last Epoch... They all have the same type of view and fall into the same category. Sure they can be called other things too, but only ARPG, to me, sticks out like this.

Even if i look at an image with the view and i see some lightning coming down with a mob of enemies around it, i just assume its an ARPG.

I know other games have this same view so ill look into gameplay but its easy for me to pick it out as being "this is an arpg" vs "this is a roguelike" or "dungeon crawler" etc.

 

[Pifanjr]

RPG: Everything else. Assassin Creed, Dark Souls, Skyrim, Wukong, Tsushima, Fallout, Elden Ring, Morrowind, etc..

I think the definition of RPG should be more narrow honestly. RPGs shouldn't be about stats and levels, but about narrative choices. In D&D communities there is often a distinction made between Role-playing and Roll-playing, with the former being about the narrative and the latter being about the stats and combat.

A lot of games that are called RPGs just include the roll-playing aspects, not the role-playing ones. Assassin's Creed might have a narrative, but it doesn't allow you to choose anything, making it an adventure game, not a role-playing game. Which is what the Assassin's Creed games were classified as before they added "RPG-elements". We just need a new name for the roll-playing mechanics like levels, XP, stats, etc.

 

[Frindis]

A lot of games that are called RPGs just include the roll-playing aspects, not the role-playing ones. Assassin's Creed might have a narrative, but it doesn't allow you to choose anything, making it an adventure game, not a role-playing game. Which is what the Assassin's Creed games were classified as before they added "RPG-elements". We just need a new name for the roll-playing mechanics like levels, XP, stats, etc.

I think it depends on the game because in Assassin's Creed: Odyssey you could choose the role you wanted to take with your character when it came to fighting style making you able to become a sneaky ninja or a bashing warrior type. You also had some dialogue options to choose from making the outcome different depending on choice.

If you take Fallout 4 for example, you can also spec your character into becoming a sneaky ninja or a bashing warrior type. The only difference is that you have more dialogue options with outcomes, but the be honest, Fallout 4 was extremely paper-thin when it came to deep roleplaying elements.

The same with the Outer World game. Looked like you had a lot of choices, but in the end, it was pretty much predefined from very simplistic narrative choices aka good/bad/somewhere in between.

 

[January's Ghost]

Would you consider Undertale an action RPG?

I never played it so I don't know.

 

[Pifanjr]

I think it depends on the game because in Assassin's Creed: Odyssey you could choose the role you wanted to take with your character when it came to fighting style making you able to become a sneaky ninja or a bashing warrior type. You also had some dialogue options to choose from making the outcome different depending on choice.

If you take Fallout 4 for example, you can also spec your character into becoming a sneaky ninja or a bashing warrior type. The only difference is that you have more dialogue options with outcomes, but the be honest, Fallout 4 was extremely paper-thin when it came to deep roleplaying elements.

The same with the Outer World game. Looked like you had a lot of choices, but in the end, it was pretty much predefined from very simplistic narrative choices aka good/bad/somewhere in between.

While having the option to pick your own play style can facilitate role-playing, it isn't part of it. Nobody would call a deck-building game an RPG just because you can choose your own play style.

I didn't know AC: Odyssey added dialogue options, but those are just the bare minimum. As for Fallout 4, I remember Fallout 3 was considered a FPS/RPG hybrid, but Bethesda has been moving away from the RPG part, both the role-playing as well as the roll-playing part, and not just for Fallout. Their games are more like sandboxes, which you can use for role-playing, but a large part of it will be happening in your own imagination.

Fun fact: I saw that Bioshock was/is considered a FPS/RPG as well, though even in 2007 that seemed questionable to people.

 

[Frindis]

Take S.T.A.L.K.E.R 2 as an example. It has just about everything, especially when it comes to narrative choices, but even the devs call it a first-person shooter, immersive sim, and horror. Why wouldn't that be an RPG?

 

[Colif]

we all arguing over the A when Really, the G is the redundant part... Action Role Playing GAME... why even say its a game? Are any of them not games?

 

[DXCHASE]

EVERY SINGLE GAME IS A RPG. There i yelled it.

 

[Pifanjr]

I stumbled upon this article:

D&D Isn't A Roleplaying Game | Yockyard

It's a combat system

www.yockyard.com

In arguing about why D&D isn't a RPG, the writer first defines what he thinks a RPG actually is and I agree with his definition.