Need help! PC Hard crashing/freezing making me hold power button to turn it off

[Inspireless Llama]

Also just wondering, but what does your event viewer tell you? It gives alot of warnings and errors which don't usually do much but I think I found the issue for my PC freezing in there, since the same minute where my PC froze there would be an error with my HyperX headset.
Sometimes it tells you an error code / event ID as well.

If there's something to be found that can be reported, it wil likely be there. Look for errors in the minute, or the minute before your PC froze or blue screened.

Event viewer --> Administrative events --> There's the log.

 

[Colif]

no dumps means it has no idea about some events. Mostly ones leading up to said crashes.

 

[Inspireless Llama]

Ah fair enough then! Must have read over that.

 

[baezyyy]

BSOD aren't predictable unless you know what cause is. Stay as is if you like, just try safe mode if it returns

@Inspireless Llama Mystic light... you probably right, been a while since i looked at driver listings so i tend to forget.

Where did you get Nvidia drivers from? The installed version is from 2022 - Nvm, Nvidia just re using a driver number

curious where mystic light comes from, I don't see it on Motherboard or AIO.
most motherboard makers at least link it on the page, but not MSI - https://www.msi.com/Landing/mystic-light-rgb-gaming-pc/download
I can't tell from the driver versions if you have newest or not.

try updating your audio drivers, I generally don't see audio cause BSOD at all but you don't have many other drivers besides Intel that I suggested updater for, and Nvidia, which you appear to be on latest now. New Nvidia isn't always best place to be but your BSOD happen and you can still see things on 2nd screen... so maybe not them.
Audio drivers are on link below:

PRO Z790-P WIFI

PRO series motherboards tuned for better performance by 14 Duet Rail Power System, DDR5 memory with Memory Boost, Lightning Gen5 PCIe, Extended Heatsink, M.2 Shield Frozr, Wi-Fi 6E, 2.5G LAN, USB 3.2 Gen 2x2

www.msi.com

For my BSOD, those are definitely more rare for me than the hard freezes I get. It's also hard to tell what's going on in Event Viewer because the only critical I see is when I force close my PC holding the power button because there is no other way to turn off my PC since my keyboard/mouse isn't responsive.

I was able to successfully clock in work for 2 hours, and right now, I am able to play Overwatch 2 with no hard freeze or BSOD so far. However, I do notice more micro stutters lately. Could it be a GPU or SSD issue?

Here is one thing that came up before I had to hold down the power button. I don't know if that would help with anything.

https://imgur.com/r18ilQq

View: https://i.imgur.com/r18ilQq.png


This is all I get when I try to run the Intel driver & support assistant.

NVM I got it to work.

https://imgur.com/70qyiTg

View: https://i.imgur.com/70qyiTg.png

 

[baezyyy]

One other thing I can think of is that I downloaded the October 10, 2023 Drivers, 537.58, BUT I never did a custom or express installation of the drivers, then the October 31st drivers came out, 546.01, but I never downloaded/installed them until the crashes started to happen more frequently a couple of days later. Could this have been the issue?

October 31st is the day I got the first freeze as well. But I did a full CMOS reset uninstalled 546.01 drivers and went back to the September 21st drivers, 537.42. And everything did seem fine for a few days, but experienced a BSOD, and another hard freeze days later. Now I'm on the latest Nvidia driver, 546.17.

I did find this just now, but I'm unsure how to update it. First time checking this app out.

https://imgur.com/yfqxN2X

View: https://i.imgur.com/yfqxN2X.png

 

[Colif]

Do you update drivers the day they released? seems a coincidence otherwise. Could be cause

Are you using the Igpu? The intel graphics are built into the CPU. - is used if you plug monitor into the motherboard
The Nvidia graphics is used if you have monitor plugged into the graphics card

So are you using both? is one monitor attached to motherboard and other to GPU? Or if not, which connections are monitors attached to on back of the case?

photo might answer it if you not sure.

I did find this just now, but I'm unsure how to update it. First time checking this app out.

I would have thought that was this:

Intel Arc & Iris Xe graphics
might need to refresh app or restart windows.

grab all the updates, they might help.

 

[baezyyy]

Do you update drivers the day they released? seems a coincidence otherwise. Could be cause

Are you using the Igpu? The intel graphics are built into the CPU. - is used if you plug monitor into the motherboard
The Nvidia graphics is used if you have monitor plugged into the graphics card

So are you using both? is one monitor attached to motherboard and other to GPU? Or if not, which connections are monitors attached to on case?

I don't. I normally only update them if I experience stutters or lag. Is there a way to check if I have remnants of the drivers I downloaded but didn't install? I was also able to update the Intel stuff except for the Connectivity Performance Suite.

I am not using that at the moment. My two monitors are plugged into my GPU.


I wish there was a reason for these freezes. Somehow, I clocked in 220 minutes in Overwatch with no crashes or freezes, and still on with no problems, while I was crashing for a good 30 minutes to an hour 7 hours ago.

 

[Colif]

any file you download and don't install is just a file. It doesn't have any extra parts yet

You probably don't need the intel drivers if you use Nvidia card but they shouldn't interfere since you not using the motherboard connectors

do you use wifi or ethernet? if ethernet, the other drivers may not help either. If you had any bluetooth devices, it will help them.

 

[baezyyy]

any file you download and don't install is just a file. It doesn't have any extra parts yet

You probably don't need the intel drivers if you use Nvidia card but they shouldn't interfere since you not using the motherboard connectors

do you use wifi or ethernet? if ethernet, the other drivers may not help either. If you had any bluetooth devices, it will help them.

Ah, alright. Should I remove all the Intel updates I just downloaded then? I do have Bluetooth devices such as my dual sense controller, and Deathadder v3 which is wireless, but I don't think that use Bluetooth.

Yeah, I do use ethernet.

 

[Colif]

i would leave them on. Just in case you do use them at some stage

I assume death adder has a dongle. not sure about the dual sense.
My xbox controller can be wired, wireless or Bluetooth

one of your problems was USB. Wifi uses usb for its operations. A lot of the hardware in windows controlled by same chips, so if one plays up, it causes others to fail.

I should run that intel updater myself, I have intel wifi & ethernet

 

[Brian Boru]

@Colif trojan work here, good sir

I don't remember all posts, so for what it's worth:

♣ Any clues in either Event Viewer or Reliability Monitor?

♦ Unplug every peripheral device except M&KB and see if you get a clear run for some days.

♥ Try each of the RAM sticks one at a time—ie remove one & see how it runs. If problem, replace with other and repeat.

♠ What size is C: drive, and how much free space on it? I assume it's not HDD.

♣ With all the hard shutdowns, there must be a serious chance of software damage. Definitely try Colif's suggestion of reinstalling Win11 before you take/ship PC to outside help.

 

[baezyyy]

i would leave them on. Just in case you do use them at some stage

I assume death adder has a dongle. not sure about the dual sense.
My xbox controller can be wired, wireless or Bluetooth

one of your problems was USB. Wifi uses usb for its operations. A lot of the hardware in windows controlled by same chips, so if one plays up, it causes others to fail.

I should run that intel updater myself, I have intel wifi & ethernet

Should I just disable wifi for the time being? It's rare that I use it.

 

[baezyyy]

@Colif trojan work here, good sir

I don't remember all posts, so for what it's worth:

♣ Any clues in either Event Viewer or Reliability Monitor?

♦ Unplug every peripheral device except M&KB and see if you get a clear run for some days.

♥ Try each of the RAM sticks one at a time—ie remove one & see how it runs. If problem, replace with other and repeat.

♠ What size is C: drive, and how much free space on it? I assume it's not HDD.

♣ With all the hard shutdowns, there must be a serious chance of software damage. Definitely try Colif's suggestion of reinstalling Win11 before you take/ship PC to outside help.

Here is a screenshot of my reliability monitor for yesterday where I was experiencing the most hard freezes.

https://imgur.com/QbLKNsE

View: https://i.imgur.com/QbLKNsE.png


Event Viewer doesn't really give many clues. This is all I got leading to the first freeze on Event Viewer.

https://imgur.com/V995GJt

View: https://i.imgur.com/V995GJt.png


Are there any other steps that I have to take for Ram?


My SSD and HDD have a lot of space on them still

https://imgur.com/3UhDksD

View: https://i.imgur.com/3UhDksD.png


Yeah, I've checked event viewer, 31 times I've had to force close my PC. So I'll try to reinstall Windows.

 

[Colif]

You been uninstalling a lot I see

had any problems since the last updates?

Brian, Event viewer doesn't know anything as the crashes aren't creating any dumps. Without the dumps, event viewer and all of windows is blind to the cause.

Should I just disable wifi for the time being? It's rare that I use it.

If you don't use it, it shouldn't be a problem. I have stacks of drivers installed that I don't use. they not in memory so they shouldn't be problem

can you go to the root of C: drive and tell me how big the memory.dmp file is

did I get you to run autoruns yet?

Autoruns for Windows - Sysinternals

See what programs are configured to startup automatically when your system boots and you login.

learn.microsoft.com

it shows everything that starts with windows
you can run as admin as its made by Microsoft
It has a driver tab

can you share a screenshot of that? You can stop things running with windows in there but if a program needs the driver, it can run it

thats enough space for almost anything
looks like my D drive

 

[baezyyy]

You been uninstalling a lot I see

had any problems since the last updates?

Brian, Event viewer doesn't know anything as the crashes aren't creating any dumps. Without the dumps, event viewer and all of windows is blind to the cause.

If you don't use it, it shouldn't be a problem. I have stacks of drivers installed that I don't use. they not in memory so they shouldn't be problem

can you go to the root of C: drive and tell me how big the memory.dmp file is

did I get you to run autoruns yet?

Autoruns for Windows - Sysinternals

See what programs are configured to startup automatically when your system boots and you login.

learn.microsoft.com

it shows everything that starts with windows
you can run as admin as its made by Microsoft
It has a driver tab

can you share a screenshot of that? You can stop things running with windows in there but if a program needs the driver, it can run it

thats enough space for almost anything
looks like my D drive

So far, no freezes since 7:30 PM. Going strong at 4 AM now, but I'm not very hopeful. It's either I have good days or bad days. Today has been a mix of both, so we'll see how it goes.

I've also attached a screenshot of Autoruns for you. If there is anything specific on this program you'd like to see, let me know!

https://imgur.com/bKBPaKo

View: https://i.imgur.com/bKBPaKo.png

 

[Colif]

I should have said to look on driver tab

don't do anything until it crashes again. Need to see if anything we did today helped.

 

[baezyyy]

Here's a screenshot on the driver tab:

https://imgur.com/0v979AK

View: https://i.imgur.com/0v979AK.png


Yeah, I won't touch install/uninstall anything else. If I do crash again, I'll do a reset of Windows tomorrow, and the last resort I guess is probably trying to send my PC in for repairs if there is any hardware related issue.

Would all the hard shutdowns I've done affect any of my hardware? I believe something is acting up since I've noticed more micro stutters in games, and a slow web browser lately. But that's probably for a different topic if I can get these freezes to stop.

 

[Colif]

you need to clean install, resets don't replace the drivers. Clean install will remove all trace of windows and start clean. If you still crash after that it is likely hardware.

Clean Install Windows 11 Tutorial

This tutorial will show you step by step on how to clean install Windows 11 at boot on your PC with or without an Internet connection and setup with a local account or Microsoft account. Windows 11 has all the power and security of Windows 10 with a redesigned and refreshed look. It also comes...

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as long as you copied everything off C, that is pretty fast to do

 

[baezyyy]

you need to clean install, resets don't replace the drivers. Clean install will remove all trace of windows and start clean. If you still crash after that it is likely hardware.

Clean Install Windows 11 Tutorial

This tutorial will show you step by step on how to clean install Windows 11 at boot on your PC with or without an Internet connection and setup with a local account or Microsoft account. Windows 11 has all the power and security of Windows 10 with a redesigned and refreshed look. It also comes...

www.elevenforum.com

as long as you copied everything off C, that is pretty fast to do

Ah, got it! I guess I'll need to purchase a USB for this.

And if I haven't said it already, I really appreciate all of your help, time, and patience throughout all this! Thank you so much!

 

[Colif]

thats okay. I try to figure out problems without sending people off to spend money. USB drives don't count really

hate to waste time and money.

Just so you know, we have bad weather here tomorrow so I might not be here a lot. should be here next day though.

 

[baezyyy]

thats okay. I try to figure out problems without sending people off to spend money. USB drives don't count really

hate to waste time and money.

Just so you know, we have bad weather here tomorrow so I might not be here a lot. should be here next day though.

Praying nothing crashes if I do a clean install. I calculated the shipping and duty & taxes, and it comes to around $1800 CAD. No way am I able to afford that... so $12 on a USB and hopefully getting my PC fixed on its own is definitely preferable!

 

[Brian Boru]

leading to the first freeze on Event Viewer.

Are you running a virtual machine? That's what "Hyper-V-Hypervisor" is about. Uninstall or at least disable if it's active—I'm not familiar with how it works.

crashes aren't creating any dumps

Is this a conscious decision by you guys? I'm fairly sure I've seen that as a setting.
Maybe Generate a kernel or complete crash dump helps?

they not in memory

@baezyyy Have you checked your Startup apps for anything unexpected or 'high impact'?
Also, run an overnight long anti-malware scan, one which includes a search for rootkits.

I'll try to reinstall Windows

I recommend a full reformat of your C: drive and full fresh reinstall. Too much danger there's something lurking now, you want to start again from a known-good state and then add things one at a time while testing that system continues to work as expected.

 

[baezyyy]

Are you running a virtual machine? That's what "Hyper-V-Hypervisor" is about. Uninstall or at least disable if it's active—I'm not familiar with how it works.



Is this a conscious decision by you guys? I'm fairly sure I've seen that as a setting.
Maybe Generate a kernel or complete crash dump helps?


@baezyyy Have you checked your Startup apps for anything unexpected or 'high impact'?
Also, run an overnight long anti-malware scan, one which includes a search for rootkits.



I recommend a full reformat of your C: drive and full fresh reinstall. Too much danger there's something lurking now, you want to start again from a known-good state and then add things one at a time while testing that system continues to work as expected.

Nope, I'm not running a virtual machine, I have no idea how to run such a thing.

I could try to generate that crash dump if it helps.

My Startup apps have all been the same from the day I first got this PC, had no issues. I actually had more startup programs on the first week of owning this PC without any issues before I started disabling/uninstalling programs to find what was causing these crashes. I only use Windows Defender. Should I get another antivirus?

I'll try to do a fresh reinstall once I receive my USB.

I also just hard froze as I was typing my response out.

 

[Brian Boru]

I could try to generate that crash dump if it helps

I don't know, I'm mostly clueless about this—just pointing it out for Colif, even experts have some blind spots

I only use Windows Defender. Should I get another antivirus?

WD is usually enough for normal use. However, your train departed the normal station a while ago, so it's worth doing a couple of deep scans via the free online scanners. I haven't done this in many years, but have a look at these:

https://www.pcmag.com/picks/the-best-malware-removal-and-protection-software

5 Best Rootkit Scanners and Removers in 2023: Anti-Rootkit Tools

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Free Rootkit Scanner and Rootkit Remover | Malwarebytes

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[Colif]

Have you ever changed the location of your page file? or disabled it completely? As that is one reason windows won't make a dump

Is this a conscious decision by you guys? I'm fairly sure I've seen that as a setting.

The system isn't completing the creation process. It freezes.. It wasn't a decision made by us, it was made by PC when it didn't make any. Its why I checked drives.

I asked them to change system to create minidumps on my 1st post. But if system doesn't there is nothing we can look at after.
event viewer relies on the info in the dumps.
Windows Error Reporting does as well.

Windows has no evidence.