Coconut Monkey Cornerclub

[Zloth]

Bah. Completely cloudy day all day yesterday. No partial eclipse for me. I couldn't really even tell the eclipse from any other random thickening of the clouds.

...especially since they already have several ways to get money from us and the people who post their videos on

Excuse me?? I pay NOTHING to post videos on YouTube. I pay NOTHING to watch them, save for watching advertisements. This has been true for many, many years now.

 

[Frindis]

Excuse me?? I pay NOTHING to post videos on YouTube. I pay NOTHING to watch them, save for watching advertisements. This has been true for many, many years now.

No, no, my point was that they earn money from the viewers. One example is from the integrated or sponsored ads or the different links on the page that you can't block ads with, and another example is from the traction a popular channel gets through the thousands or millions of people watching each day and I am also sure they get a nice cash flow from trading some of the user data (not as bad as Facebook thankfully with their strict policy?) to advertisers knowing the demographics and such even if you block ads.

If I were to guess, the new GPT systems they implement will surely be able to collect an enormous amount of useful user data when they integrate it into their different Google products (like YouTube) so that whatever you ask for/watch will blissfully make them able to market products more efficiently in the future.

YouTube is still free and that is great, but there is a reason for it also and I'm pretty sure it is not just because Google wants to be such a nice company for their consumers or that they just suddenly started to target adblockers because they are starting to get poor, especially considering they are one of the wealthiest companies in the whole wide world and probably a small slice of our solar system when they start with their asteroid prospecting business.

 

[Brian Boru]

a bit of a stretch

No, all that's been a standard business approach for ~100 years—it's called various things like loss leader and razor blade.

 

[ZedClampet]

Ubock Origin also stopped after some time, but it seems it helped to clear all of the cache. It could be just a matter of time though, since YouTube is really trying hard to combat the blockers. It's their platform, but it is a greedy, wrong move, especially since they already have several ways to get money from us and the people who post their videos on YouTube. Unity, Twitch & Facebook should be good examples of what happens when you cross that greedy line and start losing consumers or having companies looking at the competition.

If YouTube truly wants to continue making it harder and harder to use the adblockers, then I'll just pack my bags and go to another platform. It is that easy really and it was the same thing I did when the majority of TV channels started to show more and more commercials. Now I use the one TV channel that is paid for by the taxpayers and if I want to watch movies, I either rent it from the public library or I'll spend money on Amazon Prime when I feel the content is good for me both movie and gaming-wise.

This guy brings up some good points even if I don't agree with him completely. I still believe there is a limit as to how much a platform can push limitations on its consumers, without it getting a backlash. I'm sure he is right about YouTube as a company being fine with throwing out people like me who use an adblocker, but that also says something about the company does it not? Instead of meeting somewhere in the middle, they are risking the integrity of their own company just for greed.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMaFH4KzOVg&t=2s

I watch YouTube every day and haven't seen a single ad from YouTube in many years, including, obviously, the last month when YouTube has been pushing this. I do have my PC automatically clean out the cache and temp files on a twice-a-day schedule if you are thinking the cache has something to do with it.

Mostly I use it to listen to music. If I ever do start seeing ads, I'll simply record the videos of my favorite songs and just watch them off my hard drive (or just download the YT videos). The only other things I ever watch are music commentary and game trailers. Since game trailers are ads, they should be excluded. I really don't care about ads at the beginning of music commentary because those videos are always long.

I almost never watch any other type of videos unless you all link one, and I almost never watch those, either. Well, unless you've specifically posted it for me, then I watch them.

 

[Reola]

I watch YouTube every day and haven't seen a single ad from YouTube in many years, including, obviously, the last month when YouTube has been pushing this. I do have my PC automatically clean out the cache and temp files on a twice-a-day schedule if you are thinking the cache has something to do with it.

Mostly I use it to listen to music. If I ever do start seeing ads, I'll simply record the videos of my favorite songs and just watch them off my hard drive (or just download the YT videos). The only other things I ever watch are music commentary and game trailers. Since game trailers are ads, they should be excluded. I really don't care about ads at the beginning of music commentary because those videos are always long.

I almost never watch any other type of videos unless you all link one, and I almost never watch those, either. Well, unless you've specifically posted it for me, then I watch them.

What kind of magic is this? I get a million commercials per video, it's so annoying.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Its weird, my tablet where I watch most Youtube obviously doesnt have an ad blocker. The ads are annoying, but I have to say I havent watched a single one and I have no idea what they are advertising. Ill literally stare at the skip counter until it hits zero and hit it.

If a video has too many ads, ill just stop watching it and move on, and every time they try to survey me I automatically hit 'None of the above' and dont read the survey.

Is there coming a point where we are so saturated with traditional type ads that people who've been bombarded with them from a young age just filter them out entirely? Is this common ?

 

[Brian Boru]

Is there coming a point where we are so saturated with traditional type ads that people who've been bombarded with them from a young age just filter them out entirely?

Might well happen. You know the banner ads on the top of websites—if they still exist; I wouldn't know since I filter them out—they lost 75% click-thru effectiveness from '95 to '98, altho it did rebound to 50% effective around a decade ago.

But that only means other kinds of ads will take their place—ad industry is very sophisticated at finding ways into our consciousness.

 

[ZedClampet]

Is there coming a point where we are so saturated with traditional type ads that people who've been bombarded with them from a young age just filter them out entirely? Is this common ?

I stream a local radio station most of the day, and I definitely tune out during the near constant commercials.

Commercials are one of the primary reasons I don't watch regular television, anymore.

Wish I could figure out why I never get YouTube ads but others seem to be having problems even with the same adblock. And I watch on more than one computer and never see ads on any of them.

 

[Frindis]

@Brian Boru I removed that segment as I didn't think it would fit (the "a bit of a stretch"), but I am going to use it for another thread I make because the whole Microsoft data gathering is an interesting one and one I believe most people don't know about since Microsoft has been quite seamless about the whole process.

@ZedClampet More and more YouTubers use integrated or vocalized ads, so it will in that case just be a matter of time before you'll see them. The integrated ads you can't skip if they are layered into the clip and not as some do as just a segment between the clips. The vocalized ads seem to be impossible to skip with an adblocker because you'll hear a YouTuber say something like "This rifle ammo is sponsored by Sanaryon Institute" while the company logo is layered or watermarked into the video.

I believe vocalized ads are the best way to go about it because while you can skip through them manually, you are more prone to not do so (at least I am) because it is the YouTuber that you follow who is talking about it and a lot of them makes the whole thing into some type of fun story or skit also, like for example the YouTubers: Bruce River. Garand Thumb and Mr. Ballen.

The war against adblocks seems to be getting worse and worse now, so there is a high chance of me moving permanently to Twitch/Kick and/or just Patreon the very few channels I really want to follow ad-free on YouTube. I think it sucks, but mostly for the YouTubers because they will be losing a lot of viewers and subscribers which could potentially have them losing sponsors (or future ones) and I would think it would also be harder for newcomers in starting up their youtube channel. They already have it extremely hard, not to mention much more prone to getting copyright strikes out of false claims because they do not have the network that larger channels have.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Might well happen. You know the banner ads on the top of websites—if they still exist; I wouldn't know since I filter them out—they lost 75% click-thru effectiveness from '95 to '98, altho it did rebound to 50% effective around a decade ago.

But that only means other kinds of ads will take their place—ad industry is very sophisticated at finding ways into our consciousness.

Yea I remember banners, dark patterns and pop ups within pop ups.

No doubt its an arms race.

I stream a local radio station most of the day, and I definitely tune out during the near constant commercials.

Commercials are one of the primary reasons I don't watch regular television, anymore.

Wish I could figure out why I never get YouTube ads but others seem to be having problems even with the same adblock. And I watch on more than one computer and never see ads on any of them.

Yea I havent watched TV or listened to commercial radio properly in years, always end up changing the channel when ads come on. Cant stand it.

I dont see any adverts on my PC in Youtube, using Firefox and an adblocker.

@Brian Boru I removed that segment as I didn't think it would fit (the "a bit of a stretch"), but I am going to use it for another thread I make because the whole Microsoft data gathering is an interesting one and one I believe most people don't know about since Microsoft has been quite seamless about the whole process.

@ZedClampet More and more YouTubers use integrated or vocalized ads, so it will in that case just be a matter of time before you'll see them. The integrated ads you can't skip if they are layered into the clip and not as some do as just a segment between the clips. The vocalized ads seem to be impossible to skip with an adblocker because you'll hear a YouTuber say something like "This rifle ammo is sponsored by Sanaryon Institute" while the company logo is layered or watermarked into the video.

I believe vocalized ads are the best way to go about it because while you can skip through them manually, you are more prone to not do so (at least I am) because it is the YouTuber that you follow who is talking about it and a lot of them makes the whole thing into some type of fun story or skit also, like for example the YouTubers: Bruce River. Garand Thumb and Mr. Ballen.

The war against adblocks seems to be getting worse and worse now, so there is a high chance of me moving permanently to Twitch/Kick and/or just Patreon the very few channels I really want to follow ad-free on YouTube. I think it sucks, but mostly for the YouTubers because they will be losing a lot of viewers and subscribers which could potentially have them losing sponsors (or future ones) and I would think it would also be harder for newcomers in starting up their youtube channel. They already have it extremely hard, not to mention much more prone to getting copyright strikes out of false claims because they do not have the network that larger channels have.

Hey theres always Youtube Premium!

 

[Frindis]

Microsoft has been sneaking in the signing into your Microsoft account for activating Windows now for some time when you buy a computer or upgrade Windows (probably a few years at least) and it is another example of using a stronger leash on the consumers for marketing purposes. You can still make a local account and avoid some of the data gathering, but it is not as intuitive as it was before. So, if any of you want to distance yourself more from Microsoft without having to get Linux or install Tails on a USB stick, I guess this is an okay way to go about it.

My point is that why should we use our computer resources and data for Microsoft when we could at least minimize some of it, especially since you can still use the same Microsoft products but from a local account. Obviously, they want as much info as possible when you sign in and get synced through their products, but the cost is also that your computer is slowed down and you have much less control over your privacy which they could potentially sell to third parties. I understand it is different when you use a company PC and if I am not mistaken it is often only the administrator who has a local account for getting access and the ability to help users, while the others are synced with each other through Teams, Onenote, Calender, etc for convenience.

 

[ZedClampet]

Okay, you all are going to think I'm crazy, but I swear this happened exactly this way.

Well, to keep it short, on Saturday my wife and I were talking about Agatha Christie, and I said, "I wonder how many novels she wrote?" I was on my laptop so I went to Google and typed "How many" and Google suggested "How many novels did Agatha Christie write?" That's a pretty wild guess if nothing was listening to us, don't you think?

This is the first time that ever happened to me on PC. Once I was talking to Guido about Farming Simulator and opened up Facebook on my phone and the first ad I saw was for a tractor, which is not an ad I don't think you would feed just a random person.

Anyway, I turned off Chrome's access to my microphone, which is kind of a pain since I frequently use Google Voice.

 

[Frindis]

@ZedClampet The only thing I could think of (if not some company is spying) is that there is a recent activity in the search history which is what Google would look for. I dunno how that works precisely, but maybe.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

They also link you to people you spend a lot of time with somehow and their searches. Its all pretty dark.

A while ago I used to get a lot of meathead muscle building stuff because I was working with a gym guy, never talked about with him it because I dont care about that sort of thing. No need, I'm naturally toned.

 

[neogunhero]

I posted in the October Games Discussion thread about getting a month of Game Pass Ultimate from a Rockstar Energy drink. Great deal when you look at the price of GP, but I had to consume 65g of sugar to get it. I mean, no one forced me to, but it was there and I didn’t want to waste it. Disclaimer: it tasted like rotten fruit juice. It was specifically the Fruit Punch flavor which I never get. I usually drink coffee over energy drinks, and when I get one it’s usually a sugar free variety, so this was a shock to my senses and body. The flavor really did taste slightly putrid. I powered through it, jittery and ready to play games, but instead I just power cleaned my gaming setup and did laundry. I think you can also get the codes from Mountain Dew and Doritos stuff, but I don’t like either of those. Gaming companies should give codes for buying a bag of baby carrots, or a month of GP for buying some low-carb spinach tortillas, anything healthier than DoritosDewRockstar (that’s the name of the website you redeem your codes at, horrifying I know).

 

[Brian Boru]

you all are going to think I'm crazy

What, you thought we didn't already know?

I tried "how many" in DDG on Vivaldi, and in Bing & Google on Edge, and got exactly what I expected as suggestions—ie all about measurement units and conversions.

Your Agatha experience is way too far out—but of course you need to have Hercule investigate to be sure. Iexpect he will ask "Bien sur—what did you expect, using an advertising company's browser to search on an advertising company's site"

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

What, you thought we didn't already know?

I tried "how many" in DDG on Vivaldi, and in Bing & Google on Edge, and got exactly what I expected as suggestions—ie all about measurement units and conversions.

Your Agatha experience is way too far out—but of course you need to have Hercule investigate to be sure. Iexpect he will ask "Bien sur—what did you expect, using an advertising company's browser to search on an advertising company's site

Also Google Maps, Android location services, Maybe a surface level machine learning analysis of any Google photos you store in the cloud and whatever else you sign away in the small print when you allow their systems and services access so they can profile you. I used to try and avoid it but its pretty useless at this point.

Its scary how much they can predict about a persons tastes or what they might search based on their online habits and where theyve physically been. For the most part we really are all quite predictable.

 

[Brian Boru]

allow their systems and services access

I use ShutUp10 to manage a lot of that—works on 11 too.

we really are all quite predictable

I knew you were going to say that.

I used to try and avoid it but its pretty useless at this point

I wonder will it ever be worse than the small villages of centuries ago, where many people lived their whole life? Nah, probably not—now those were scary!

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

If you use an Apple or Android phone, etc its hard to avoid without becoming completely detached from everything.

Its the political implications that are the scary part, the rest is just distasteful.

Theyre taking educated punts based on that info and its not always going to work, but they were really good at it 10 years ago, already, with machine learning and data analysis its only going to get worse.

 

[Frindis]

I have cut off the localization on most of my phone apps. I have the Bitdefender recovery on (so I can shred data if my phone gets stolen) and emergency GPS localization in case I get stuck somewhere or sick. The only ads I occasionally get are whenever I have opted to be a member to get a discount on a first buy and forgot to remove my membership afterward. My phone is pretty much clean of ads compared to my different e-mails. My work email is the only one completely without any type of spam/ads.

The one thing I really dislike about the new phones is that they make it incredibly hard for you to fix them yourself and that you need special tools to open different parts. Thankfully I have the Ifixit (lol, I'm starting to sound like an ad now) so you can bet I'll be using that whenever I need to fix the screen or change parts. It's stupid that companies make it almost impossible to use normal tools and try to explain it with "Oh no, we can't let you do that, you might hurt yourself or break the phone" It is my bloody phone and I'll do whatever I want with it as I see fit! Well, at least after the warranty has gone *cough*.

 

[ZedClampet]

Its scary how much they can predict about a persons tastes or what they might search based on their online habits and where theyve physically been. For the most part we really are all quite predictable.

The problem with it being a simple prediction is that the last time I know I had thought about Agatha Christie was, per Steam, July 22, 2016 when I finished the ABC Murders game, and my wife isn't an Agatha Christie person, either, but had just found an Agathe Christie movie on her phone from either Netflix or Amazon Prime. She then asked me if I was familiar with the story. I said I was and that I had always enjoyed Agatha Christie stories in the past. At that point, out of nowhere, I said, "I wonder how many novels she's written?" and went to Google.

As far as I know, before that couple of minutes, there was zero reason for anything to predict I was about to ask about Agatha Christie. Perhaps it knew my wife had wandered past an Agatha Christie movie in the last few minutes on her phone and just took a wild guess, but the simplest solution, Watson, is that something was listening to our conversation.

Now, it could have been one of our phones that was listening, as it's been proven that this takes place, but the fact that I'd given Chrome access to my microphone makes the whole Chrome listening thing rather plausible. There's no reason to think the same people who are listening in on your phone wouldn't also do it on your PC.

 

[Pifanjr]

The problem with it being a simple prediction is that the last time I know I had thought about Agatha Christie was, per Steam, July 22, 2016 when I finished the ABC Murders game, and my wife isn't an Agatha Christie person, either, but had just found an Agathe Christie movie on her phone from either Netflix or Amazon Prime. She then asked me if I was familiar with the story. I said I was and that I had always enjoyed Agatha Christie stories in the past. At that point, out of nowhere, I said, "I wonder how many novels she's written?" and went to Google.

As far as I know, before that couple of minutes, there was zero reason for anything to predict I was about to ask about Agatha Christie. Perhaps it knew my wife had wandered past an Agatha Christie movie in the last few minutes on her phone and just took a wild guess, but the simplest solution, Watson, is that something was listening to our conversation.

Now, it could have been one of our phones that was listening, as it's been proven that this takes place, but the fact that I'd given Chrome access to my microphone makes the whole Chrome listening thing rather plausible. There's no reason to think the same people who are listening in on your phone wouldn't also do it on your PC.

You can download all of the data Google has from you. My wife did it once and it included a bunch of audio fragments, most of which weren't directed to her phone.

 

[ZedClampet]

You can download all of the data Google has from you. My wife did it once and it included a bunch of audio fragments, most of which weren't directed to her phone.

Thanks. I'm in the process of getting the data now.

 

[Brian Boru]

the simplest solution, Watson, is that something was listening to our conversation

Do/did either of you have any voice-activated app laying dormant in the background? Eg a Speak to Text or an Alexa-type app.

They all have to listen and send every word back to the server, in order to detect if you spoke the magic activation word.

As I said earlier, that's too far out to be a coincidence, but equally it's too far out to be deliberate—the thousands of people testing for just this would be all over it in a heartbeat. So probably some weird crossover glitch.

 

[ZedClampet]

I said that I never watch videos, but it turns out I'd just never found one at my intellectual level. I was just now perfectly happy watching a 20 minute compilation of people getting pantsed.