Science Fiction; books, tv, films and games.

[ipman]

Yes that's what I meant, if you mention Darwin's theories to many they quote that line, but Darwin didn't write it and it was added later, partly as a publicity hook, but it does also put a different spin on his theory. But obviously we know better

Darwin is a scientist I really respect for his dilligence.

 

[ipman]

I mentioned that idea that humans have been used like biological robots for centuries.

Moon is a film that extrapolates that idea using human clones. Sam Bell works for the corporation on the moon and believes when he has finished his contract he will be sent back to Earth, but is just incinerated and replaced by another clone of the original Sam.

Sam discovers secret clone warehouse

 

[Brian Boru]

It's a technique

Ok, we may be talking mostly about the same thing, just using different world views to house it

What you describe has been used for millennia—I can't give you concrete example offhand, but definitely seen it in my trawl thru ancient civilizations. 'Normal' people do it all the time too, eg I occasionally wake up with a new idea or way to approach some problem. Sub-conscious rocks!

So yes, it's a technique as you say, neurons at work, not some mystical journey to distant vapor

ETA: Archimedes' famous 'Eureka' moment.

 

[Frindis]

I think a number of things will have to change to reach that utopia. Firstly humans need to transcend their tribal nature and that extends to; country vs country, religion vs other religion(replace if necessary with Zen Buddhism), male vs female, minority of rich vs poor, etc, so that all humans are equal and valued,( ie: one humanity all working for the common good and sharing equally food and resources). Also birth control is necessary and the human population needs to be managed so we don't consume the planet's resources.

I played through Dagon yesterday and I stumbled upon a quote from Lovecraft I found to be fitting in the conversation:

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Oh absolutely, surely that is the long-term goal of Homo Sapiens, to speed the evolution of the next hominin species in the chain. There have been 10-20 before us, I wonder how many after us?

Does it work like that? That one day someone will have a baby and it will just end up being a lot taller/shorter and smarter then the rest of us and they'll take over in 20 years and we'll end up in the zoo? I didnt think so but genuinely don't know.

I was under the impression we evolve generation over generation tiny bit by bit. If that's the case, attributing all our negative traits and actions to 'human nature' just seems to me a way for people to abdicate responsibility. Oops sorry I didnt mean to steal it but it was there and my animal nature took over, yer Honour. Not Guilty!

You talk about impact on humanity, and that's a given. I was talking about impact on policy and decision makers—ministerial always truthful soundbite aside—which has always been negligible.

I have one big example that comes straight to mind. Objectivist thinking has been highly influential in the last 40 years. Politicians, and billionaires from Greenspan, Musk, to Trump, Sajid Javid and more have cited Ayn Rand as an inspiration, via Atlas Shrugged or The Fountainhead. You could argue she was a philosopher, but then many authors and artists have a philosophy that permeate their works, and can't that also be influential? Animal Farm and 1984 have already been mentioned.

If you Google literary influence on politics there's a whole lot more out there. I only had a quick look and although I like history I'm no proper historian so there must be many more examples of art affecting change in reality.

There's also a swathe of technologies that were predicted/inspired by science fiction, Star Trek alone has a load, and Arthur C Clarke a load more. It wont be a straight shot, but the idea has to come from somewhere, and someone messing with physics or engineering might then dredge up out the subconcious a vague memory on something they read or saw a long time ago, and wonder if that just might be possible with what they are working on.

Geez we got seriously real in a PC Gamer thread about Science fiction books. I'm interested to read it all, but kind of exhausting to be honest. I just like the vidya games, and I'm mostly a dumdum who reads a bit.

 

[Brian Boru]

there must be many more examples of art affecting change in reality

There's a problem with your argument, which is the cart before the horse

Rand's 'philosophy' can be summarized as that of selfishness—greed, individuality without care for fellow man, freedom without responsibility. Such thinking is millennia old, there's nothing new in it except the assembling together of various previous practices.

In the good old days, rulers and rich could act mostly with impunity—they took what they wanted, they destroyed at will. European colonial powers are one big example among many. In more recent times, they can't get away with such overt selfishness.

So… they look around for philosophical and intellectual ways to justify what they want to do. There will always be material to be found, eg Rand's work. There's a reason no one took her stuff seriously before some groups saw profit in using her stuff to excuse their behavior.

So she didn't influence anyone who mattered. Rather, they used her, and similar, to sell their behaviour to the masses—and it's worked well to a degree, they have manufactured a following for her, and use her as a symbol for their goals.

The selfish will always seek out justification for their actions, when they need wider support to pursue it.

To the broader point, there's so much stuff published that some of it is bound to end up close to what happens. Last time I checked, it was ~2,000 books per day. Most aren't relevant to our discussion of course, but that's still a lot of predictions and thoughts being propagated.

I expect we would find that those writings which have influenced are almost all from people who display impartiality and rigor in their arguments, rather than the preaching of those like Rand.

a swathe of technologies that were predicted/inspired by science fiction, Star Trek alone has a load, and Arthur C Clarke a load more

Again, cart & horse I would mostly say "popularized" rather than 'predicted/inspired'. They're they guys who put it out there, so people probably assume they came up with it all. That's not how it works—best expressed by Newton's 'standing on the shoulders of giants' comment. Not that he came up with it, but he popularized it

That's not to take away from the talents of those guys. As you say, no wonder that "someone messing with physics or engineering" would produce good stuff.

we got seriously real

I blame Ipman, he's a bad influence!

I'm mostly a dumdum

Once you've realized that, your education can begin

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

I'm not a fan of Rand at all either, but I'd rather not talk too much further because it gets too political.

Put simply I think the cart is behind the horse which is behind another cart ad infinitum. Its impossible to say where an idea is rooted because there are a million influences on every one. Because of that I dont think its possible to say that Sci fi, art and literature cannot have had any influence on the people behind political ideas or technology at all.

 

[ipman]

Does it work like that? That one day someone will have a baby and it will just end up being a lot taller/shorter and smarter then the rest of us and they'll take over in 20 years and we'll end up in the zoo? I didnt think so but genuinely don't know.

I was under the impression we evolve generation over generation tiny bit by bit. If that's the case, attributing all our negative traits and actions to 'human nature' just seems to me a way for people to abdicate responsibility. Oops sorry I didnt mean to steal it but it was there and my animal nature took over, yer Honour. Not Guilty!



I have one big example that comes straight to mind. Objectivist thinking has been highly influential in the last 40 years. Politicians, and billionaires from Greenspan, Musk, to Trump, Sajid Javid and more have cited Ayn Rand as an inspiration, via Atlas Shrugged or The Fountainhead. You could argue she was a philosopher, but then many authors and artists have a philosophy that permeate their works, and can't that also be influential? Animal Farm and 1984 have already been mentioned.

If you Google literary influence on politics there's a whole lot more out there. I only had a quick look and although I like history I'm no proper historian so there must be many more examples of art affecting change in reality.

There's also a swathe of technologies that were predicted/inspired by science fiction, Star Trek alone has a load, and Arthur C Clarke a load more. It wont be a straight shot, but the idea has to come from somewhere, and someone messing with physics or engineering might then dredge up out the subconcious a vague memory on something they read or saw a long time ago, and wonder if that just might be possible with what they are working on.

Geez we got seriously real in a PC Gamer thread about Science fiction books. I'm interested to read it all, but kind of exhausting to be honest. I just like the vidya games, and I'm mostly a dumdum who reads a bit.

Evolution does fascinate me and it does happen quicker than orginally thought. (quick Google) Body size changes because of the interaction between; genetics, environment, lifestyle practices like diet and technology. So it's clear looking at the present generation of youngsters that they are generally taller and healthier.

Apparently our brain size is becoming smaller but the complexity of our neural networks may mean humans are more intelligent. I think education, access to information from books, culture and the Web must be changing how humans evolve intellectually.

Something they promoted at uni(over twenty years ago for me) is to not seperate different fields of study, but to see the integration. Our minds collect all sorts of information from many fields, including fact and fiction and make connections. One of human's greatest assets is to be creative.

Lets face it gamers and PC geeks are often stereotyped, but that's clearly not the case as most of us have knowledge of many areas, know about vast amounts of culture and are well read. I think it's good to have a few threads where we flex a bit and one thing I enjoy about forums is that sometimes I do have to think, do have to formulate concepts and then go off researching new ideas.

 

[ipman]

To the broader point, there's so much stuff published that some of it is bound to end up close to what happens. Last time I checked, it was ~2,000 books per day. Most aren't relevant to our discussion of course, but that's still a lot of predictions and thoughts being propagated.

I expect we would find that those writings which have influenced are almost all from people who display impartiality and rigor in their arguments, rather than the preaching of those like Rand.


Again, cart & horse I would mostly say "popularized" rather than 'predicted/inspired'. They're they guys who put it out there, so people probably assume they came up with it all. That's not how it works—best expressed by Newton's 'standing on the shoulders of giants' comment. Not that he came up with it, but he popularized it

I was watching an interview with Isacc Asimov yesterday. The interviwer was congratulating him that many years before it happened he had perdicted that humans would travel to the moon in 1974. Asimov explained how he researched the scientific knowledge at that time and how he had taken in to account potential developments and come up with a date, obviously several years later than it actually happened. He also said that working on that basis he came up with many predictions(like you say) that didn't happen. It's just retrospectively people focus on the few that did.

Another of human's important survival traits or ways of thinking is forethought. It must have proved vital to the survival of early humans planning ahead for potential shortages, inclement weather or planning long treks.

And the same is true today, humans extend their thoughts and plans into the future. What will we do if a devastating asteroid heads towards the Earth. We are aware of the potential for annihilation based on past events. There's another sub genre, disaster Sc Fi films that express the generalised anxiety that humans feel, anything from; virus contamination, nuclear war, asteroids or alien invasions.

The thing that freaked me out(at a very young age) about that Star Trek vid, was the desciption of 'Gideon covered in a living mass who can find no peace no joy'. On their fictional planet they had similar obsessions to humans; the sanctity of human life, longevity, regeneration or replacement organs, freedom from diseases and infections.

But then human life starts to look like a virus that spreads across the planet, destroying eco sstems, causing mass extinction of all other species and consuming all of Earth's resources until only humans are left.

I'm not sure if there are other inhabital planets out there in the cosmos, we simply don't know and the conditions that allowed life to survive on the Earth may not exist anywhere else. I do believe that humans will develop the spaceships, propulsion systems and tech to make long distance space travel possible, and that is a major theme in Sci Fi and an example of specualtive forethought.

Also films and games that show what a post apocalypse Earth might look like and be like to inhabit where even the basic resources are scarce can open up a debate about how we manage our precious resources and our precious planet.

 

[ipman]

Humans have pondered on the possibility of alien life for millenia, but in relatively recent times H G wells's War of the World's impacted on the human imagination and Orsen Wells in his 1938 famous radio broadcast made it seem realistic with fake newscasts.

I think its an example of the power of imagination when you think about how many variations of alien life have been shown in films, books and tv.

The Man who Fell to Earth imagines what would happen if an Alien came to the Earth because life one his own planet was dying because of the lack of water supply. It's a reversal and says a lot about the corrupting values of life on Earth and the mistrust of humans.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-79ehaNJ8c&ab_channel=TheaestheticoftheImage%3A%5Bworld%5Dcinemaclips
Elon Musk was an avid reader on Sci Fi as a boy, quoting the Foundation series by Isacc Asimov.
'Foundation Series & Zeroth Law are fundamental to creation of SpaceX,” tweet from June 2018

 

[Brian Boru]

I dont think its possible to say that Sci fi, art and literature cannot have had any influence on the people behind political ideas or technology at all

Oh I completely agree—certainly over millennia there have been some ideas floated which eventually crystallized into practical implementations. Plus of course hundreds or thousands as many which sank without trace.

And you're right, it's veering towards the political, so best left for elsewhere

one day someone will have a baby and it will just end up being a lot taller/shorter and smarter then the rest of us

Oh, forgot about that bit. It happens both ways. There can be sudden major surges, usually linked to environmental events. The biggest example is the Cambrian explosion which in practice started complex life on earth almost all at once.

There are also what you mention, small incremental steps year by year or generation by generation, called 'mutation'. Someone here mentioned a good example a few days ago, the toads in Oz which are getting bigger and growing longer legs as they progress across the country. Another is when I spent some time in Florida with family, there was a thing there about their native lizard having to quickly evolve to cope with some invasive species.

Let's not get into viruses etc, many of which seem to evolve every year—eg flu, covid. Some pests quickly evolve to counter our efforts to eradicate 'em.

There also seems to be a 'natural direction' to some evolution, demonstrated by eg crabs which have evolved multiple times throughout history. It's an interesting field, with much left to discover.

Something they promoted at uni(over twenty years ago for me) is to not seperate different fields of study, but to see the integration

An early formative experience for me was Connections, one of the BBC's outstanding non-fiction productions—still well worth a watch. As the internet fosters far easier access to info, I expect to see a lot of advancement coming out of the integration you mention.

one thing I enjoy about forums is that sometimes I do have to think, do have to formulate concepts and then go off researching new ideas

An idea isn't of value until it's been tested

causing mass extinction of all other species and consuming all of Earth's resources until only humans are left

It's worth noting that best current estimate is that over 99% of all species which have lived on earth are extinct—average lifespan 3m years if I recall correctly. So don't wring your hands too much, our planetary impact is nowhere near as important as we'd like to believe

Also noteworthy is the increase in human population, how it has always matched available resources and our ability to extract 'em. Or of course, been whacked by environmental disasters like the Indonesian eruption ~70K ago which may have reduced our pop to under 10K.

Exploration and exploitation has driven us so far, and I see no reason that'll stop.

if there are other inhabital planets out there in the cosmos, we simply don't know and the conditions that allowed life to survive on the Earth may not exist anywhere else

Mathematics makes it a certainty there's a myriad of such places. We are not some god's special one-off creation

humans will develop the spaceships, propulsion systems and tech to make long distance space travel possible, and that is a major theme in Sci Fi and an example of specualtive forethought

What's the forethought on the physical impact of such travel on human bodies? Is there anything beyond cryo?

I think I've heard that if Voyager was aimed at Proxima Centauri, it would get there in 40K years. So we've got work to do!

Problem with reaching habitable planets is they may be much too far away. So the realistic objective has to be to develop spaceships which are fully autonomous and self-sustaining for thousands of years. Would we even need planets then?

how we manage our precious resources and our precious planet

What's special about the 3rd Rock from the Sun?

We're probably not far off from limitless energy, which is the fundamental resource we need. Most of the moves away from fossil fuels lead to such a conclusion.

Minerals—more than we can ever use are nearby in the solar system. Food and water should be easy, whenever we decide to make 'em a priority.

an example of the power of imagination when you think about how many variations of alien life have been shown in films, books and tv

Is "power" the right word? Maybe "susceptibility" or similar might be closer to what is. Perhaps Voltaire said it most succinctly—"if God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent Him".

Current humans have a built-in need to believe in a higher purpose—we have far too much hubris and insecurity to accept that like every other of the tens of millions of species here, we cease to exist in any form after we die. I'll bet there have been more variations of gods than aliens invented so far


"Fun"—maybe that's the word.
Fun to use imagination to make up an alien with @Colif's pointy head and @WoodenSaucer's transport preference—altho wood in space, dunno about that
Or fun to imaginatively construct a god with @ZedClampet's flowing beard and @Kaamos_Llama's demeanor.

Yeah, sounds good—I vote for FUN!

 

[ZedClampet]

Mathematics makes it a certainty there's a myriad of such places. We are not some god's special one-off creation

Not necessarily. When we think of the size of the universe, we put all reason aside and engage in a bit of the :"gambler's fallacy".

Based on genetic testing, all life on our planet originated from the same origin. That means that after billions of years, life apparently started once on the only planet we know of with perfect conditions for life. I suspect life in the universe is exceedingly rare, and intelligent life even rarer.

But even if there are a billion intelligent, space traveling species, we'll probably never know. That would make one space faring species for every 200 galaxies. It's highly unlikely that any species would ever travel much farther than their own star system.

Also, I wouldn't completely rule out a creator god.

 

[ipman]

It's worth noting that best current estimate is that over 99% of all species which have lived on earth are extinct—average lifespan 3m years if I recall correctly. So don't wring your hands too much, our planetary impact is nowhere near as important as we'd like to believe

I just remember how much the whale population was decimated mainly to supply oil for lamps, and that led to a shortage which prompted the development of petrochemical industry.

But also in my lifetime the amount of birds I see now is miniscule compared to when I was young. There could be numerous factors;

Around here I've noticed that birds only sing in the middle of the night, the noise of cities drowns out there mating songs.
Also insects absorbing insecticides and that accumulating in birds. Like it does for any animal higher up the food chain.

Humans have used some toxic chemicals to increase production of food. I live near a river and when they electo fished a long stretch(150miles), they found virtually no fish because of toxic chemical run off from farm land.

 

[ipman]

Not necessarily. When we think of the size of the universe, we put all reason aside and engage in a bit of the :"gambler's fallacy".

Based on genetic testing, all life on our planet originated from the same origin. That means that after billions of years, life apparently started once on the only planet we know of with perfect conditions for life. I suspect life in the universe is exceedingly rare, and intelligent life even rarer.

But even if there are a billion intelligent, space traveling species, we'll probably never know. That would make one space faring species for every 200 galaxies. It's highly unlikely that any species would ever travel much farther than their own star system.

Also, I wouldn't completely rule out a creator god.

I agree, and glad you're joining whatever this is

Life on Earth seems to be as a result of a number of unique events; perfect distance from the sun, the way volcanoes released some gases and then organisms helped create a breathable atmosphere.

Life and evolution itself is often based on random mutations and has sometimes had a precarious chance of survival.

I think it is possible that life on some planet in some very distant universe may exist, but the distances involved means that none will ever be extant within the same cosmic time frame as humans. Also that life form may be so distinct to ours as to make contact or communication totally impossible. Or deadly to humans not only in terms that they may be destructive but also their diseases, etc.

I just think humans don't like to believe that we and all life on Earth aren't alone in such a vast space.

But I think that much localised space exploration will revolve around mining other uninhabitable planets and then as future humans slowly establish bases further afield they may find a potential new planet that could be made habitable through terraforming. I think robots will be used to travel those long distance as high radiation and other effects of space travel will make it deadly for humans until we can cover vast distance quickly.

Star Trek pilot aired 1966 when NASA was preparing to launch Gemini 11. First space shuttle orbiter was supposed to be named Constitution but Trekkies petitioned and it was changed to Enterprise. NASA hired Nichelle Nichols(Lt Uhura) to recruiting campaign for new astronauts in 1977. Shatner received NASA distinguished Public Service Medal for 'For outstanding generosity and dedication to inspiring new generations of explorers around the world, and for unwavering support for NASA and its missions of discovery'.

from> https://www.nasa.gov/feature/55-years-ago-star-trek-debuts-begins-an-enduring-relationship-with-nasa

 

[ipman]

I do like Sci Fi that is set in the not too distant future. WD's(£10 Steam) Legion is such a game, with it's mass surveillance, drones continually flying above and used to police the populace.

Here's Sky Larsen imaging the future, 'what if we could scan the human brain and upload the neural map to the cloud? Well it would mean the end of human suffering, of death itself and the beginning of a new society where war, oppression, disease, are all worries of the past'.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tri1ds9rR9Q&ab_channel=JohnArbiterPlaystationGaming

 

[WoodenSaucer]

Just want to put out a reminder, at the risk of being disliked more than I already am, that there are a lot of people on this planet of all levels of intelligence who hold their religion and relationship with God as something very sacred and integral to their lives...a lot of people. So while I'm not saying everyone should believe the same way, or disbelieve the same way, it seems like it would be a beneficial thing to humanity and society to not ridicule people for their dear beliefs. There's nothing productive in that.

 

[Alm]

Whilst I am not devoutly religious, I do believe in some sort of God. I can see why people are intolerant of religion but I agree that isn’t the best way..

 

[ipman]

Just want to put out a reminder, at the risk of being disliked more than I already am, that there are a lot of people on this planet of all levels of intelligence who hold their religion and relationship with God as something very sacred and integral to their lives...a lot of people. So while I'm not saying everyone should believe the same way, or disbelieve the same way, it seems like it would be a beneficial thing to humanity and society to not ridicule people for their dear beliefs. There's nothing productive in that.

With respect @WoodenSaucer this is a thread about Sci Fi and part of that discussion on this page has been about how to protect humans, all life, our precious resources and our precious Earth.

And part of the original premise was how Sci Fi books films, tv and games can fascilitate that by promoting utopias over dystopias.

So surely which ever belief system people adhere to, they would also hope that Humans through their culture can open up debates which lead to us keeping Earth as a utopia for humans and all life.

 

[ZedClampet]

Just want to put out a reminder, at the risk of being disliked more than I already am, that there are a lot of people on this planet of all levels of intelligence who hold their religion and relationship with God as something very sacred and integral to their lives...a lot of people. So while I'm not saying everyone should believe the same way, or disbelieve the same way, it seems like it would be a beneficial thing to humanity and society to not ridicule people for their dear beliefs. There's nothing productive in that.

I'm very pro God, though I struggle to believe. The primary driver behind the decline of religion and belief in a God is the existence of the anti-science, pro Hell Fundamentalists. But that's a topic for a different forum perhaps. In any event, I once made a long study of apologetics and there are some compelling arguments. Many of the greatest philosophers of our time are actually believers. Some very, very smart folks.

 

[ipman]

I'm very pro God, though I struggle to believe. The primary driver behind the decline of religion and belief in a God is the existence of the anti-science, pro Hell Fundamentalists. But that's a topic for a different forum perhaps. In any event, I once made a long study of apologetics and there are some compelling arguments. Many of the greatest philosophers of our time are actually believers. Some very, very smart folks.

Hey not being funny guys, but would you mind starting a different thread. Sci Fi and religious beliefs are two very distinct topics.

 

[ZedClampet]

Hey not being funny guys, but would you mind starting a different thread. Sci Fi and religious beliefs are two very distinct topics.

Not just no, but Hell no. We don't need a thread on religion. Brian brought it up. Wooden was offended (which is one reason we don't need to talk about it). I simply offered my support to Wooden. We should be good now (and if a mod wants to delete all references to God, that would be great, too).

 

[ipman]

Not just no, but Hell no. We don't need a thread on religion. Brian brought it up. Wooden was offended (which is one reason we don't need to talk about it). I simply offered my support to Wooden. We should be good now (and if a mod wants to delete all references to God, that would be great, too).

Well I can't speak for @Brian Boru, but he quoted Voltaire and he spoke of the 'hubris and insecurity' of humans.
Plus it's a fact that there are and have been many belief systems, some with a god and some without.

So surely that respect should extend to those who have a scientific viewpoint as well,and as far as I know a scientific belief system and a religious belief system aren't mutually exclusive.

But this is a thread about Sci Fi promoting utopias over dystopian futures.

So with respect please start another thread.

 

[WoodenSaucer]

With respect @WoodenSaucer this is a thread about Sci Fi and part of that discussion on this page has been about how to protect humans, all life, our precious resources and our precious Earth.

And part of the original premise was how Sci Fi books films, tv and games can fascilitate that by promoting utopias over dystopias.

So surely which ever belief system people adhere to, they would also hope that Humans through their culture can open up debates which lead to us keeping Earth as a utopia for humans and all life.

We don't need to start a new thread, and I'm not going to continue derailing this one. I've just noticed a trend of people basically calling people who believe in God stupid, and I just don't think that's a good mindset or attitude to have. But it wasn't just this thread, and I'm sorry I chose your thread to finally say something.

I'm very pro God, though I struggle to believe. The primary driver behind the decline of religion and belief in a God is the existence of the anti-science, pro Hell Fundamentalists. But that's a topic for a different forum perhaps. In any event, I once made a long study of apologetics and there are some compelling arguments. Many of the greatest philosophers of our time are actually believers. Some very, very smart folks.

Thanks for the support, man. And I'll be done after I say this one thing. Religious people who are anti-science drive me nuts, too. I actually have an interpretation of things in the Bible that doesn't contradict scientific findings. I don't necessarily believe that every interpretation of scientific findings is true. But I definitely believe in the findings, themselves.

But to put all of this in perspective with the topic at hand, I believe that you will never have a true utopia if people can't learn to respect people's differences, rather than belittle people out of their hubris. Understanding that you can love and respect people, even if you don't agree with them on everything, is one big part of being able to have a utopia. You have to look at the social and psychological sides of things, as well as the scientific side of creating a utopia. It all works together.

 

[Brian Boru]

we'll probably never know … It's highly unlikely that any species would ever travel much farther than their own star system

I agree re the travel. Drake's equation provides a range of between zero other intelligent species in the Milky Way to many millions of them—it's not an equation in the math sense of providing an answer, rather a guide for factors involved in speculating estimates.

Another major problem is the number of active galaxies out there, which are quite likely to kill off species during their cycles of destruction and renewal. We're fortunate that the Milky way has been quiet for a few billion years, but that will probably change and could wipe out our far-distant successor species if they don't have the tech to withstand the enormous forces at play.

all life on our planet originated from the same origin. That means that after billions of years, life apparently started once on the only planet we know of with perfect conditions

I'm not sure about that. ~99% of all life on earth is made up of only a few elements—less than 10 if I recall correctly—and those elements were produced many billions of years before the solar system—back near the Big Bang for lighter elements, later for heavier.

It's reasonable to assume that as those elements—and of course, almost all the others—spread thru the expanding universe, they landed on many of the trillions of planets out there.

religion. Brian brought it up. Wooden was offended

I did, didn't I? Sorry folks, that was careless. Sorry specifically to Woody & Zed.

It's not a topic we want in the forum, as Zed summarized.

Apology to Ipman too, caused a ruckus in your thread

 

[ZedClampet]

I'm not sure about that. ~99% of all life on earth is made up of only a few elements—less than 10 if I recall correctly—and those elements were produced many billions of years before the solar system—back near the Big Bang for lighter elements, later for heavier.

Sorry, I'm not sure I understand your point, but I'm very sure my point was terribly written/explained. What I should have said was that DNA tests show that all life on our planet is related, so whatever geological/electrical events caused life to form either only happened once, or whatever other life was created died out.

Logically (to my brain), those creation events probably happened here where the life is, but who knows? I'm not sure why some people think this happened elsewhere or why that would really be important. The question, "How did life begin" isn't answered by, "It began on Mars." If we find a remnant of life on Mars, I'm not sure that actually tells us anything.

Probably none of that adressed what you were saying.