What games have the most complex controls? (use most of the keyboard, etc)

[ZedClampet]

This is not a contest. I'm just curious, after having been playing Farming Simulator, what other games have just outrageous control schemes.

This morning I went to the customize controls section in the Farming Simulator options, and there are, by my possibly not-exactly-right counting, 191 things you can assign keys to. Needless to say, every standard key on the keyboard is assigned something. Then you have <shift> + key, <mouse button1> + key, <mouse button2> + key, etc.

Many keys are assigned to multiple things, but are context sensitive. If you are driving a machine, you have 3 sets of controls besides WASD. You have one set each for when you are holding left mouse button, right mouse button, and both mouse buttons at the same time.

Some things are available to assign keys to, but don't default to any key. God help you if you decide you want to assign those to anything other than an extra mouse button because doing so will set off a nightmarish chain of key assignment switches.

I use both a controller and my keyboard/mouse at the same time. If you are on console, you have to learn how to use bumpers and triggers and other buttons to pull up more options. For instance, if you are driving a tractor, you press "Y" to cycle through control schemes until you get to the one you need. Fortunately, your options can be shown on the top left of the screen if you need them.

So what other games have complex controls? I imagine @Zloth 's X4 Foundations is pretty complex. Maybe some of @mainer 's CRPG's?

 

[Colif]

You would think this is an easy question to answer but well, Google is special needs and can't answer questions any more. Its more suited to selling you crap you don't need. If answer to question exists on the internet, Google doesn't know it.

Mechwarrrior supposedly uses a lot of keys

Slaves of Armok: God of Blood Chapter II: Dwarf Fortress - uses the entire keyboard.

flight simulators can have silly controls too, if you have the money

 

[PCG Ted]

You mentioned CRPGs Zed, made me think of Pillars of Eternity 2, specifically one of its challenge modes that removes pause-and-play. It's a prerequisite of Josh Sawyer's infamous max-difficulty "Ultimate" run whose winners got commemorated on a plaque at Obsidian.

IMO Pillars is already more complex than the old Infinity Engine games and hard enough to keep up with in turn-based or pause-and-play modes, those challenge runners are wrangling with dozens of abilities, status effects, other RPG-y mechanics on the fly.

 

[ZedClampet]

You mentioned CRPGs Zed, made me think of Pillars of Eternity 2, specifically one of its challenge modes that removes pause-and-play. It's a prerequisite of Josh Sawyer's infamous max-difficulty "Ultimate" run whose winners got commemorated on a plaque at Obsidian.

IMO Pillars is already more complex than the old Infinity Engine games and hard enough to keep up with in turn-based or pause-and-play modes, those challenge runners are wrangling with dozens of abilities, status effects, other RPG-y mechanics on the fly.

Some brains are multitasking machines. Some brains are single equation brute force machines. My brain is the latter. I can do one thing at a time. I do that thing well, and might be able to solve problems the multitaskers can't, but start adding other stuff to the equation, and I crash and burn. If I were an air traffic controller, everyone would be dead in a month.

All that to say, I wouldn't be very good at that challenge mode

 

[WoodenSaucer]

What game uses the most keys on the keyboard? Zork

 

[Brian Boru]

Google is special needs

Do people still use Google? How quaint.

https://www.gamesradar.com/gamings-most-ridiculously-complex-control-schemes/

Which games have the most complex controls

Let me know when someone maps a tough RPG boss fight—ie repeating the same moves 687 times over 60+ minutes—to a dance mat.

 

[Zloth]

I don't know any program that tops Visual Studio, though I wouldn't be surprised if AutoCAD beat it out. But those aren't games.

Looks like X4:Foundations is somewhere in the neighborhood of 150? Some of that is really unfair, though - different ways to move your selection around on a menu when you're probably going to use the mouse to select the option hardly matters.

Fighting games could have the most, if a series of key inputs count. Every move made takes a unique combination of keys, and could change depending on stance. Each fighter has different moves, too, so people typically learn to use just a few fighters. Here's Sarah's from Dead or Alive 5:

View: https://youtu.be/700HkdVPaF8?t=7

That many moves times roughly 35 fighters? That's a ridiculous number of inputs to memorize!

 

[Pifanjr]

You would think this is an easy question to answer but well, Google is special needs and can't answer questions any more. Its more suited to selling you crap you don't need. If answer to question exists on the internet, Google doesn't know it.

Mechwarrrior supposedly uses a lot of keys

Slaves of Armok: God of Blood Chapter II: Dwarf Fortress - uses the entire keyboard.

flight simulators can have silly controls too, if you have the money

Mechwarrior 5 has 53 according to its manual.

Dwarf Fortress has about 162 for fortress mode if you count each building separately plus another 50 for adventure mode.

Microsoft Fligth Simulator uses 303 different input combinations according to this: https://www.pcgamer.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-2020-controls-keyboard-controller

I don't know any program that tops Visual Studio, though I wouldn't be surprised if AutoCAD beat it out. But those aren't games.

Looks like X4:Foundations is somewhere in the neighborhood of 150? Some of that is really unfair, though - different ways to move your selection around on a menu when you're probably going to use the mouse to select the option hardly matters.

Fighting games could have the most, if a series of key inputs count. Every move made takes a unique combination of keys, and could change depending on stance. Each fighter has different moves, too, so people typically learn to use just a few fighters. Here's Sarah's from Dead or Alive 5:

View: https://youtu.be/700HkdVPaF8?t=7

That many moves times roughly 35 fighters? That's a ridiculous number of inputs to memorize!

Visual Studio was my first thought as well. Some actions need a combination of CTRL+<letter> and then another CTRL+<letter>.

I don't think every single move in a fighting game counts as a separate input though. Especially since a lot of moves in fighting games are mechanically very similar.

 

[Colif]

combos: length of game depends on skill of users, so how many keys are used varies greatly.
there are infinite combo moves in same games, so length depends on how long you can be bothered to play the same game and click same buttons

killer instinct got a little silly

 

[Pifanjr]

For Arma 2 based on this image I get to 168+:

https://imgur.com/hV7zhlm

View: https://i.imgur.com/hV7zhlm_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

 

[Brian Boru]

a ridiculous number of inputs to memorize

Wouldn't a lot of the combos be assigned to macros for serious players? So that 1 key will run a combo of many moves.

 

[ZedClampet]

Wouldn't a lot of the combos be assigned to macros for serious players? So that 1 key will run a combo of many moves.

I don't play fighters. Would that be considered cheating?

Do people still use Google? How quaint.

Just out of curiosity, what are people using these days?

 

[Colif]

Wouldn't a lot of the combos be assigned to macros for serious players? So that 1 key will run a combo of many moves.

or un serious players, Sacred 2 let you do that 12 years ago so I hope games can still do that now. used to be able to map up to 4(I may be wrong) attacks into one combo so they all went off after each other.

it could be seen as cheating in a fighting game unless its open, then its who can click combo button fast enough I guess.

I have seen people map photo shop macros to individual keys on a DAS Keyboard so all the keys have images on them to portray what command will do

 

[WoodenSaucer]

I don't know any program that tops Visual Studio, though I wouldn't be surprised if AutoCAD beat it out. But those aren't games.

I think when it comes to programming, Vim for Linux probably beats Visual Studio when it comes to complex keyboard shortcuts. A lot of Linux programmers swear by it. Personally, I'd rather have a simpler graphical IDE than have to memorize a ton of keyboard shortcuts.

Just out of curiosity, what are people using these days?

A lot of people who don't want to be tracked and they don't want biased search results use Duck Duck Go. Personally, I still just use Google. It has a lot more useful stuff integrated into it.

 

[mainer]

Maybe some of @mainer 's CRPG's?

I've looked through a lot of the games I've played, sometimes even dragging out the boxed version & manual, but I didn't find anything comparable to the 191 you have for Farming Simulator. None that I remember have overly complicated keyboard (or keyboard + mouse) controls. Some have several key combo situations, like shift + or control + another key, but not difficult when you use them frequently. A lot depends on how fast you have to press those keys or combos in a combat situation. How do you keep track of all those key combinations?

Do people still use Google? How quaint.

Just out of curiosity, what are people using these days?

I still use Google. It serves my purposes well enough, but I'm a quaint sort of guy.

 

[Zloth]

Wouldn't a lot of the combos be assigned to macros for serious players? So that 1 key will run a combo of many moves.

You could probably set up some sort of macro to press the keys, but that would definitely be cheating. They do let you map some pairs of keys to the shoulder buttons, like A+B, but you have to get the timing down on when to press a series buttons.

I think when it comes to programming, Vim for Linux probably beats Visual Studio when it comes to complex keyboard shortcuts. A lot of Linux programmers swear by it. Personally, I'd rather have a simpler graphical IDE than have to memorize a ton of keyboard shortcuts.

For sure.

 

[Brian Boru]

what are people using these days?

Oh I was just snarking, 'everyone' still uses Google—it has around 90% share worldwide, maybe 95% mobile and 85% desktop. I use DuckDuckGo as default, but Bing and Google when necessary.

I also have a bunch of sites which I use a lot setup for search—good time saver, cos I search a lot.

I'd rather have a simpler graphical IDE than have to memorize a ton of keyboard shortcuts

Me too—I already have a load in my head from Windows, Office etc. I tried the excellent AutoHotKey long time ago, but needing to remember killed it for me. My current general shortcut app is TypeItIn which is best of both worlds, ie shortcut keys and simple very functional UI—of course UI is only really useful on a second monitor.

 

[Pifanjr]

I think when it comes to programming, Vim for Linux probably beats Visual Studio when it comes to complex keyboard shortcuts. A lot of Linux programmers swear by it. Personally, I'd rather have a simpler graphical IDE than have to memorize a ton of keyboard shortcuts.

Based on https://vim.rtorr.com/, I count 234 keyboard shortcuts for Vim.

Based on https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/vi...board-shortcuts-in-visual-studio?view=vs-2022, I count 310 global shortcuts, with a couple hundred more of context specific shortcuts (I did not feel like counting all of those too).

It would make sense for Visual Studio to have more shortcuts, as it simply has far more functionality than vim. Even if the text editing is more limited, there's so many other features that all have their own shortcuts.

And this is only the actions that have a default shortcut. There's probably several hundreds more that don't have a shortcut by default for which you can specify your own.

 

[Colif]

long ago before Google was good and then turned useless, I used this: https://copernic.com/en/ but it used to aggregate search engine results, now it just finds files on your PC. their webagent stopped working in 2014, about last time Google was useful. As soon as Google had control it was lets remove features time and make it as annoying as possible for people who have used library databases and know better. I hate it... guess they are in business of selling ads but come on. I would pay for an actually useful search engine.

 

[WoodenSaucer]

Based on https://vim.rtorr.com/, I count 234 keyboard shortcuts for Vim.

Based on https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/vi...board-shortcuts-in-visual-studio?view=vs-2022, I count 310 global shortcuts, with a couple hundred more of context specific shortcuts (I did not feel like counting all of those too).

It would make sense for Visual Studio to have more shortcuts, as it simply has far more functionality than vim. Even if the text editing is more limited, there's so many other features that all have their own shortcuts.

And this is only the actions that have a default shortcut. There's probably several hundreds more that don't have a shortcut by default for which you can specify your own.

Even if it's true that VS has more shortcuts, I would almost guarantee that they're used more in Vim. Vim is text-only, while VS is created to be more "Visual."