October 2025 General Games discussion thread

[Colif]

Guess I will start this one...

Updates to Xbox Game Pass: Introducing Essential, Premium, and Ultimate Plans - Xbox Wire

Introducing the new upgrades to Xbox Game Pass, including Essential, Premium and Ultimate. Details inside.

news.xbox.com

Microsoft Game pass changes

reaction: Website for cancelling Gamepass currently down due to demand...

I might try to access it later. I have it but never really used it.

 

[Pifanjr]

Guess I will start this one...

Updates to Xbox Game Pass: Introducing Essential, Premium, and Ultimate Plans - Xbox Wire

Introducing the new upgrades to Xbox Game Pass, including Essential, Premium and Ultimate. Details inside.

news.xbox.com

Microsoft Game pass changes

reaction: Website for cancelling Gamepass currently down due to demand...

I might try to access it later. I have it but never really used it.

€30 a month for virtually unlimited entertainment seems like a great deal when compared to something like cable TV. Too bad that most PC games can get you far more hours of entertainment per dollar than any TV show or movie can, so it's much cheaper to just buy a few games on sale or play one of the many free or free to play ones.

 

[Frindis]

I stopped paying for Game Pass around 2 years ago or so when they stopped with the "get Game Pass for 1 month for 1SUD (something like that) promotions. That is when I knew they were going to get greedy, and I was right. I stopped using Amazon Prime when they started introducing more and more shitty games and worse and worse prime benefits, and I knew it was only going to get worse, and I was right. I stopped using Netflix whenever they made it harder and harder for more people to share the same account, and I knew Netflix would get worse, and I was right.

LOL! It's like I am psychic or something:

The end of Prime Gaming! Amazon bets on Luna with major subscription changes

Amazon is shaking things up with its subscription service! Say "goodbye" to Prime gaming....

gg.deals

 

[neogunhero]

For the last two days I’ve had this intense sharp pain come and go in the back of my neck, and yesterday morning it caused a massive migraine the second I woke up. I decided to call in from work which I always hate, I feel more guilty than satisfied that I get to rest. That didn’t stop me gaming though, I ended up picking up Yakuza Like A Dragon. As much as I like the series, I never played this one because I didn’t think I’d like the turn based combat, I never do. Thankfully it’s done in a way that is not traditional, it’s easier for newcomers to turn based combat to get the hang of.

Story wise it’s great already. I’m only 4 hours in, about half of that playtime is cutscenes, and I love it. Ichiban Kasuga seems so similar yet so different to Kiryu Kazuma, main protagonist of the core series games.

Ichiban shows a lot of character early on by being a very honest kind of Yakuza, more interested in honor to the family than collecting money. Things shake up pretty quickly and the man you thought was your mentor had seemingly turned against you after -8 years in the slammer. There is always a major dramatic switch early in the game that sets the tone of the rest of the story, some may say it’s predictable but it’s done in such a over the top dramatized way that it’s hard not to be entertained by it.

The combat was very easy to learn. Its turn based but real time in a way since your characters don’t stay still in one spot, they are constantly moving with the fight. You select between attack, defend, special moves and items during your turn, then while enemies are attacking you can land a perfect parry to reduce incoming damage. I like how when you select your attack, if there is an object in your path to the enemies you will either pick it up or kick it at the enemy. I’ve only gotten to have one other party member so I haven’t gotten to experience fighting with a full team yet.

So far I’m loving it just as much as I like Yakuza 0 and the Kiwami games. $10 for this masterpiece is insane to me. Very glad I found something good to play.

 

[dxchase]

For the last two days I’ve had this intense sharp pain come and go in the back of my neck, and yesterday morning it caused a massive migraine the second I woke up. I decided to call in from work which I always hate, I feel more guilty than satisfied that I get to rest.

Even though we all do at some point, im here to tell you to NEVER feel guilty about calling in. Thats what the time is for, whoever you are working for will still make all the money they need. Your health is 100% more important than a jobs quota and margin line. I dont know your job and life obviously lol but you shouldnt feel guilty for healing yourself.


Started playing Alien: Rogue Incursion Part One yesterday. Its... not bad, im a sucker for the Alien franchise and have enjoyed everything to come out, from the very cheesy Alien Resurrection to the brilliant Alien: Earth series and all the comics, also the game is a FPS. So i kinda had a bias going in. Also, the characters in here are from a separate alien comic series, but the story is original.

So, playing through, it feels more like, and i agree with this assumption others have made, they took a VR game and just made it for flat screens. The atmosphere is fine enough, i wish they would make it more eerie and dark with a S.T.A.L.K.E.R. -type atmosphere but, at least with HDR on an OLED, it looks fine enough.

The gun sounds are kinda off. They nail the original sound of the pulse rifle, but it sounds like the guns are being shot in an echo chamber. The combat is ok, aliens sneak up on you and you have to use your detector to see them coming which adds an element of realism to the series and the AI synth with you is also not terrible either, but the Aliens are bullet sponges and you move very awkwardly (THERE IS NO JUMP!!). The FPS view is kinda weird too. The gun placement is off and it can be a little jarring to me where they sit, but i can deal with that.

Will continue to play since its Aliens.



Other than that, im basically just playing Diablo 4 at this point. Im just getting to the spot in the season where its really just about pushing up my "paragon level" to max and being able to push 1 or 2 activities to the very end. I could start another character utilizing all the new stuff this season but im not sure i will yet. Battlefield 6 comes out in a little over a week on-top of whatever else will come out before the end of the current Diablos season. Its fun but, all seasons in D4 run their time in about a month, month 1/2 with me before its boring and i want to move on.

 

[BeardyHat]

For the last two days I’ve had this intense sharp pain come and go in the back of my neck, and yesterday morning it caused a massive migraine the second I woke up. I decided to call in from work which I always hate, I feel more guilty than satisfied that I get to rest.

Ouch, sorry to hear. Migraines are the absolute worst. Hopefully you're a bit better today.

My sinus infection is finally lifting, though I'm expelling a lot of stuff...

Haven't played a ton the last few days. I'm still close to finishing RoboCop and I was pretty deep in to Baldur's Gate EE and really having fun, but the last few days I've been preoccupied with trying to get Linux sorted on my HTPC and as expected with Linux, running into issue after issue.

It's not like I can't get these things sorted, I can, but it feels a lot like playing Dark Souls, except way less fun. It's a challenge that I'm well aware I can get through, it just requires me banging my head against the wall repeatedly until there's a breakthrough; but with Linux, it's like boss after boss. You break through one and immediately run into another one and I'm just...tired. I just want this machine to work without having to mess with it, but I run into problems and hacked together solutions (which actually do work) around every corner and I'm just...

Kind of done. I've finally given in and am just forcing a Windows 11 install on this unsupported hardware (only because it's one generation out of date with an i7-7700). Apparently after doing some reading, the only a** pain I'll have to go through with is having to do yearly feature updates manually, which is just fine with me. Creating a bootable USB via Rufus and updating to 26H2 or whatever it will be is far less of a hassle than anything I've run into with Linux in just the past couple of days.

Otherwise, I'm hopefully going to get back to RoboCop and BG, but I've also started a new game for a game challenge on another forum I'm on, which is Chrono Trigger. It's currently on sale on Steam, but I've actually chosen (so far) to play it on my SNES I repaired about 5-years ago. I've got it hooked-up to a CRT in my basement and it just feels...good. I usually prefer to play on handhelds so I can move about the house, but so far, I'm enjoying the deliberateness of having to play in one spot on particular hardware. And worst case, since I'm running it off an FXPackPro in the SNES, I can grab the MicroSD and put the save on any device I want if I feel like changing over.

 

[neogunhero]

Started playing Alien: Rogue Incursion Part One yesterday. Its... not bad, im a sucker for the Alien franchise and have enjoyed everything to come out, from the very cheesy Alien Resurrection to the brilliant Alien: Earth series and all the comics, also the game is a FPS. So i kinda had a bias going in. Also, the characters in here are from a separate alien comic series, but the story is original.

Based on how you describe it and the trailers, it really looks like Alien Isolation with some pretty basic gun mechanics slapped on. Lack of jump in 2025 is crazy to me, I feel like you'd have to program a game engine to NOT allow it. It does look pretty good besides those minor gripes.

Even though we all do at some point, im here to tell you to NEVER feel guilty about calling in. Thats what the time is for, whoever you are working for will still make all the money they need. Your health is 100% more important than a jobs quota and margin line. I dont know your job and life obviously lol but you shouldnt feel guilty for healing yourself.

In my case, it's really just me and one other person who run the office's day to day operations. The other two, the owners and office manager, are pretty elderly with their own issues. Everything went smoothly even without me there yesterday, but still, kind of makes me feel a bit of guilt as my head felt like it was being kicked in by a pair of steel toe boots.

Kind of done. I've finally given in and am just forcing a Windows 11 install on this unsupported hardware (only because it's one generation out of date with an i7-7700). Apparently after doing some reading, the only a** pain I'll have to go through with is having to do yearly feature updates manually, which is just fine with me. Creating a bootable USB via Rufus and updating to 26H2 or whatever it will be is far less of a hassle than anything I've run into with Linux in just the past couple of days.

You're probably well aware of this program but running something like O&O ShutUp 10++ on a Win11 install with an older CPU may be very beneficial to gain some extra performance and disable all the bloatware crud MS stuffs into it.

I usually prefer to play on handhelds so I can move about the house, but so far, I'm enjoying the deliberateness of having to play in one spot on particular hardware. And worst case, since I'm running it off an FXPackPro in the SNES, I can grab the MicroSD and put the save on any device I want if I feel like changing over.

Cross-platform progression on an SNES to handheld is insane when most modern games still don't offer that.

 

[Colif]

Creating a bootable USB via Rufus and updating to 26H2 or whatever it will be is far less of a hassle than anything I've run into with Linux in just the past couple of days.

I always update via a USB, but mainly as I am impatient and want to be on latest instead of letting windows decide when I can have it.
Or at least, I used to be. Windows updates don't really excite me now and if its going to force AI down my throat, I am willing to wait.

Friend does support for clients he builds PC for. All he getting now is panic stories from people getting Win 11 scare messages on their Win 10 PC... must be good for profits.

Just tell people their PC will explode when Win 10 stops getting updates, and you can profit off unnecessary upgrades. I used Vista for 8 years after it stopped getting support. Just use another Anti virus program when Defender stops updating. No updates can be a good thing, no new problems introduced.

 

[Pifanjr]

Even though we all do at some point, im here to tell you to NEVER feel guilty about calling in. Thats what the time is for, whoever you are working for will still make all the money they need. Your health is 100% more important than a jobs quota and margin line. I dont know your job and life obviously lol but you shouldnt feel guilty for healing yourself.

I don't think I've ever felt guilty for calling in sick. I don't call in sick very often, but that's mostly because I don't want to deal with any potential hassle if I were to call in sick too frequently. Also because the first sick day is unpaid and I'd rather just work all day at 50% efficiency than rest the whole day without getting paid.

the last few days I've been preoccupied with trying to get Linux sorted on my HTPC and as expected with Linux, running into issue after issue.

This was my experience when I tried out Linux as well. I really hope SteamOS becomes available for desktop soon so I can just use that on our old PC.

 

[BeardyHat]

You're probably well aware of this program but running something like O&O ShutUp 10++ on a Win11 install with an older CPU may be very beneficial to gain some extra performance and disable all the bloatware crud MS stuffs into it.

Cross-platform progression on an SNES to handheld is insane when most modern games still don't offer that.

I've tinkered with it on my laptop, but not much beyond that. I may give it a go depending on how things are looking on the laptop with the 4th gen i7 and 970m. It's currently running Teardown for my 5-year old and it's running a little slowly, but still playable, but I think that's pretty much how it ran before too.

And SD cards, man. Well, SD Cards and severs anyway. Grab the SD out of the FXPak Pro, put the save on my Server and then grab it through the file explorer on Android. It's pretty neat.

I actually have a Persona 3 Portable save that I started on an emulator on my phone, moved to an actual PSP, moved to a PS Vita, then back to emulation on Android.

I always update via a USB, but mainly as I am impatient and want to be on latest instead of letting windows decide when I can have it.
Or at least, I used to be. Windows updates don't really excite me now and if its going to force AI down my throat, I am willing to wait.

Friend does support for clients he builds PC for. All he getting now is panic stories from people getting Win 11 scare messages on their Win 10 PC... must be good for profits.

Just tell people their PC will explode when Win 10 stops getting updates, and you can profit off unnecessary upgrades. I used Vista for 8 years after it stopped getting support. Just use another Anti virus program when Defender stops updating. No updates can be a good thing, no new problems introduced.

Yeah, they're certainly not exciting anymore. I have a lot of old hardware lying around that I want to make use of, is my problem. Linux is great in most cases, but it's just so damned fiddly for whatever I want to do with it. I assume if I was just a developer or only wanted to use the web, it would be no trouble at all.

But I am going to keep an eye on Craigslist and see if anyone is giving away old, incompatible hardware...

This was my experience when I tried out Linux as well. I really hope SteamOS becomes available for desktop soon so I can just use that on our old PC.

The difference between SteamOS on hardware it's made for and Linux on any old thing is just amazing. I have zero complaints about Linux on my Deck and I'm regularly poking around in the desktop there, installing things that aren't meant for it, making tweaks, etc, it's no trouble at all.

But somehow, as soon as I get it on a laptop or desktop, I have nothing but issues. And it's not that I can't solve it, it's just that that's what I spend a huge amount of time doing and I'd rather get on with my life. Linux isn't hard, it just requires excessive amounts of time to get working the way I want.

 

[Frindis]

For anyone interested in the newly released Digimon: Stranger Stories, you can get it on Gamesplanet (official reseller) for 15% less and if you add the coupon code: XELEKO, you'll get an additional 2% off. At least in my region, this is roughly 17USD cheaper (including the transaction fee using VISA) than buying it on Steam.

Digimon Story Time Stranger Steam Key for PC - Buy now

Digimon Story Time Stranger is an RPG with monster-taming elements that explores the deep bond between humans and Digimon in an epic story that unravels the mystery of the world’s collapse.

us.gamesplanet.com

 

[Pifanjr]

I started Nightingale to see how it would run. The character creation was weirdly choppy, but once I got to walk around the performance was fine. I only did the first bit of the tutorial until you go through your first portal, but so far the atmosphere is great and just moving around and swinging a weapon feels good too.

---

I just finished the first week of the first winter in my Stardew Valley game. So far it's going pretty well. I upgraded almost all my tools to gold and have a bunch of sprinklers. My farming, mining and foraging skills are all level 8, with fishing at 10 and combat at 6 and I've reached the end of the cave. I have 5 or more hearts with 11 people. I just built a barn and a coop and got a cow and a chicken and I only need to complete two more community bundles, the vault and the bulletin board. The vault just requires money, so I should be able to finish that before the end of the year, but the bulletin board needs items that can only reliably gotten in the second year.

 

[neogunhero]

Played a good two hours of Skin Deep last night and I have to tell you guys, if you're an immersive sim sicko like I am you HAVE to check this one out.

The whole premise is that you're an "insurance commando" named Nina Pasadena who is frozen in a cryogenic pod on a spaceship when some space pirates start hijacking it. You wake up and clear out the ship to find out that you have an intergalactic hit-woman doppelganger chasing after you. You then play through a series of levels which are other spaceships hijacked by pirates and have to save sentient cats who inhabit the ships. You're given many different tools, systems and mechanics to complete your goals with a high level of interactivity in the world which opens up to some very creative ways to play.

I’m only a few levels in mainly because I’m taking my time with each thing. The writing is very good, so I’m reading each email and note I find. You have a scanner tool in this game which allows you to hyper focus on the innocuous labels placed on various objects such as a sink, box of black pepper, vents, and more. They give you hints on how to interact with them, such as letting you know they emit an electrical spark when bashed against an object or that they produce a flammable gas when used. This has made me want to scan and read everything I can find in the game. Many notes are placed throughout the levels to give subtle hints, such as where certain vents lead to or that a grenade is hidden inside of a derelict service robot.

I’ll have to play more to give more thoughts on it, but first impressions are through the roof with me. I can see myself replaying the levels over and over trying to unlocks all the optional goals and do runs in different ways than I did the first time. There is workshop support but sadly not many mods uploaded at all. At least half of them are from the devs meant to serve as modding tutorials.

 

[Frindis]

@Pifanjr I tried Nightingale some months ago, but I thought it was a bit weird and janky. I think some of it had to do with the resource gathering being wonky. StarDew Valley is a fantastic game that I never manage to get into! I don't know why, but every time I jump into it, I end up playing for half an hour or so and then I jump to another game. It could be that it is too slow-paced for me, but I also play turn-based games. Maybe it is because the walking is slow when I think of it, probably because I am underleveled.

 

[Frindis]

Wanted to share this with @Zedclampet... @mjs warlord maybe something for you?

Steam Autumn Sale: Transport Fever 2 delivers a new historical low of $3.99!

The absolutely stacked Transport Fever 2 Deluxe Edition's also at its best-ever price, and costs just 81¢ more!

gg.deals

 

[Pifanjr]

@Pifanjr I tried Nightingale some months ago, but I thought it was a bit weird and janky. I think some of it had to do with the resource gathering being wonky.

I must admit that my expectations are pretty low for this game. It's still in early access, so I fully expect it to be janky, but even besides that I typically get bored of (open-world) survival-crafting games pretty quickly. Too often the mechanics are not well-integrated and they just feel like several mediocre games mashed together.

StarDew Valley is a fantastic game that I never manage to get into! I don't know why, but every time I jump into it, I end up playing for half an hour or so and then I jump to another game. It could be that it is too slow-paced for me, but I also play turn-based games. Maybe it is because the walking is slow when I think of it, probably because I am underleveled.

I've gotten pretty far into Stardew Valley in the past when playing together with my wife, but we eventually abandoned that save. I've never gotten very far by myself because it is indeed too slow to keep my interest for very long, but I've been playing it on my phone and that works a lot better. The game works a lot better for me if I just play one or two in-game days at a time every couple of days or so. It also helps to build the stable as soon as possible so you can get around faster on a horse.

 

[Frindis]

I must admit that my expectations are pretty low for this game. It's still in early access, so I fully expect it to be janky, but even besides that I typically get bored of (open-world) survival-crafting games pretty quickly. Too often the mechanics are not well-integrated and they just feel like several mediocre games mashed together.

Have you tried this one? https://store.steampowered.com/app/1326470/Sons_Of_The_Forest/ I played the first one and while I did not get that far, it was fun enough. I'm considering getting it

The game works a lot better for me if I just play one or two in-game days at a time every couple of days or so. It also helps to build the stable as soon as possible so you can get around faster on a horse.

Thanks for the tip!

 

[BeardyHat]

Wanted to share this with @Zedclampet... @mjs warlord maybe something for you?

Steam Autumn Sale: Transport Fever 2 delivers a new historical low of $3.99!

The absolutely stacked Transport Fever 2 Deluxe Edition's also at its best-ever price, and costs just 81¢ more!

gg.deals

An absolute steal for $3.99. One of my favorite games and I've gotten hundreds of hours of entertainment out of it, though it takes some effort to understand.

 

[Pifanjr]

Have you tried this one? https://store.steampowered.com/app/1326470/Sons_Of_The_Forest/ I played the first one and while I did not get that far, it was fun enough. I'm considering getting it

I haven't, but one of my friends played the first one and the sequel for quite a bit and was positive about it. It seems to me like it would be more fun to play with friends, which is why I didn't buy it. I don't get to play with my friends often enough to warrant paying €20 and by the time it got discounted my friends had stopped playing.

 

[Pifanjr]

I played a bit more of Nightingale. So far I haven't had any trouble with the resource gathering being janky. It helped that I saw someone mention you can hold E to automatically pick up everything around you, it probably would've been a lot more obnoxious to pick up everything individually.

I'm still pretty early in the game, but, like other open world survival crafting games, it's not doing a great job at actually immersing me into the game. I feel like I'm just going from PoI to PoI, occasionally fighting some enemies and grabbing some resources, but without anything to make that process interesting. On the surface it's a very similar gameplay loop to, for example, Skyrim, but when I play Skyrim I feel like I'm a person in that world, not like I'm just going down a checklist of icons on a map/tech tree.

I'm planning on giving it a bit more time to see if the game gives me more reason to care about progressing.

 

[Johnway]

Not much to talk about on my front, i've been looking for a game to play on my pc and i need to think what handheld game to play next, probably something on my 3ds, maybe fire emblem awakening (assuming i can save whenever i want...) but i'm still mourning not being able to finish my shin megami tensei 4 save game. I did try again on my SD card and its dead but i just can't let go...

With win10 support ending and my pc can't support win 11 i'm sitting on the fence as to whether i upgrade now rather then later. It just that its not decision to take lightly tbh. my current pc is more then adequate and i would like to wait another year or 2 before i consider it. Maybe longer. i have a rough idea what i want, 64gb ram, 9800x3d, 4tb ssd and a 5070 (waiting for that super) are my desire. So i guess £2500-£3k.

 

[BeardyHat]

Not much to talk about on my front, i've been looking for a game to play on my pc and i need to think what handheld game to play next, probably something on my 3ds, maybe fire emblem awakening (assuming i can save whenever i want...) but i'm still mourning not being able to finish my shin megami tensei 4 save game. I did try again on my SD card and its dead but i just can't let go...

With win10 support ending and my pc can't support win 11 i'm sitting on the fence as to whether i upgrade now rather then later. It just that its not decision to take lightly tbh. my current pc is more then adequate and i would like to wait another year or 2 before i consider it. Maybe longer. i have a rough idea what i want, 64gb ram, 9800x3d, 4tb ssd and a 5070 (waiting for that super) are my desire. So i guess £2500-£3k.

Worth noting that I just upgraded two of my unsupported PCs to Win 11 and so far, so good. Performance on the desktop seems great so far, no different than Windows 10. Games, I'm not sure yet. Two games we've played on it have had poorer performance, but that may be due to hardware, not sure yet. Can't recall how they were on Win 10.

As for 3DS, I actually recently started Warioland or whatever it's called on a Virtual Boy emulator on my 3DS. 3d effect works flawlessly and actually, it's a pretty fun game too. Always wanted a VB when I was a kid, so pretty fun to be able to play it.

Also recently started Chrono Trigger SNES version and am actually really loving it, much to my surprise. I tried the DS version on my 3DS, but just didn't feel like playing it that way, though it's the definitive version apparently, so I might recommend checking that out if you either own it or have your 3DS hacked.

 

[Johnway]

Worth noting that I just upgraded two of my unsupported PCs to Win 11 and so far, so good. Performance on the desktop seems great so far, no different than Windows 10. Games, I'm not sure yet. Two games we've played on it have had poorer performance, but that may be due to hardware, not sure yet. Can't recall how they were on Win 10.

As for 3DS, I actually recently started Warioland or whatever it's called on a Virtual Boy emulator on my 3DS. 3d effect works flawlessly and actually, it's a pretty fun game too. Always wanted a VB when I was a kid, so pretty fun to be able to play it.

Also recently started Chrono Trigger SNES version and am actually really loving it, much to my surprise. I tried the DS version on my 3DS, but just didn't feel like playing it that way, though it's the definitive version apparently, so I might recommend checking that out if you either own it or have your 3DS hacked.

i have chrono trigger on the DS and finished it a couple years back (maybe a decade ago?!) i believe the ds version is the playstation version. i remember liking the game and if i got the game on the snes it would have blown my mind as it was way ahead of its time with its time traveling mechanics and how well it was designed.

So i decided to play fire emblem awakening and just doing it in casual mode as i want to just get it one and done. i'll need to look into the support mechanics to see how it works, whether its like in the classic GBA/DS support where you can only A rank one person and b rank one other person. From what i've seen support is much stronger now, if support characters are nearby the advantages. The more people the better.

 

[Zloth]

I stopped paying for Game Pass around 2 years ago or so when they stopped with the "get Game Pass for 1 month for 1SUD (something like that) promotions. That is when I knew they were going to get greedy, and I was right.

Nah, that's not getting greedy, that's getting profitable. They put the product out there for super low cost, lose money, get lots of customers to start paying, make the product good, lose more money while draining away customers from any competition (essentially dumping on the market) and/or preventing new competition, then finally raising prices. Ideally, they don't do that until they think they are pretty much a monopoly, but they'll also do it if they just can't afford to lose so much money anymore.

IMHO, there's simply no way they could have kept that price point, at least with new games. It might work with older games, though, if you could somehow get people out of the "I must play what just came out" habit.

 

[dxchase]

Not much changed here for me either, still Diablo 4 mainly on my own and Borderlands 4 here and there with the wife (2 campaign bosses down 2 to go that I know of) and a little bit of this Alien: Rogue Incursion, which is getting tougher on this hard difficulty because they keep throwing xenomorphs at me, its like the real thing!

Battlefield 6 drops thursday, will be there for sure, pre-installed over the weekend just gotta get through this week of work before it .

Hope youre feeling better @neogunhero body pain sucks.