Question PC freezes and crashes after being idle

[isen]

Specs:
CPU: Intel Core i7-9700K
Ram: Corsair CMK16GX4M2Z3600C18 16GB DDR4 running at 3600MHz
GPU: Asus ROG Strix RTX 2060 Gaming OC (with the latest drivers from Nvidia installed)
PSU: Corsair AX860
Motherboard: ASUS ROG Strix Z390-F Gaming
OS: 64 bit Windows 10(19043.1081) running on an SSD, INTEL SSDSC2BW180A4
BIOS Version: 1802

Whenever I try to use my computer after it has been idle for a while it stops registering mouseclicks on anything on the desktop and any open programs, the desktop goes white and task manager doesn't open(not from Ctrl+Shift+Esc or Ctrl+Alt+Delete). Even the taskbar disappears but the desktop icons and mouse are still there, even though I can't do anything with them. This freeze or crash or whatever you want to call it can happen if I simply right click on my desktop right after it has been idle.

I have the default settings for the "High Performance" power setting on, so hibernation and power saving is set on "never" in the power options and the screen is set to turn off after 15 minutes (but but wether or not the screen is turned on shouldn't impact anything?). As I wrote in the specs I have BIOS version 1802, which is the latest BIOS version for my motherboard on ASUS's website that isn't a beta version. I updated two days ago from version 1502 hoping that maybe my problem would be solved but it was not. I've used Norton 360 to make a full PC scan and it found nothing. I also ran sfc /scannow in Powershell as an administrator and it concluded that nothing was wrong. I have even gone through every process in Task Manager multiple times and made sure that any program that shouldn't be there is gone (although there are a few ASUS processes left that I'm not sure if I can quit or not).

Don't know if this is relevant, but I have heard that USB devices can cause problems so I'll just list them. I have a Corsair Gaming Ironclaw RGB mouse, a Corsair Strafe RGB MK2 keyboard, a Logitech G Pro X Wireless Lightspeed headset, an Arozzi Sfera microphone and an old Logitech HD Webcam C270. For the Corsair products I have iCue installed and for the Logitech headset I have G Hub installed.

Any ideas for what more I could try? A fresh install of Windows 10 will be my last resort.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Has this always happened or did it start recently after a Windows update or something? If so you can potentially roll back to a restore point. I'm not much good with advice for Windows, but there are others here who may be able to suggest more software related things to try.

Hardware wise, first off you should disable XMP for your RAM, run it at defaults and see if that helps. If it does you may have to give a bump your DRAM or IMC/system agent voltage a touch over the XMP settings, I dont have any experience with Intel platforms after 7000 series so you might need to ask over at Toms Hardware for specific advice on that unless someone here has first hand knowledge. If playing with voltages worries you it may also work if you enable XMP and simply change the speed manually to 3200 in BIOS instead.


Its also possible a small bump in a CPU related voltage might help, I've had and seen systems stable under load that drop voltage down too low at idle causing instability, again Toms might be a better place for specifics on that.

If its not the RAM, to find out of its a USB issue remove all USB devices possible and see if it still happens. If not return them one by one until it does.

 

[Brian Boru]

Check Reliability Monitor and/or Event Viewer for warning messages at the times the system dies—hopefully they'll point at whatever's failing.

Check in Device Manager for any yellow warning icons—expand each category so you see all the individual components.

Since it sounds like a power issue—system goes to sleep and won't wake up—it's worth trying each of the different Power Plans to see if things improve under any of them. It might be as simple as High Performance isn't turned on properly and a switch in and out of it will fix it.

Are you aware of the Ultimate Performance plan? It's suited to a high spec machine like yours, I run it on a much lower spec PC. Here's a quick video segment about it:
Ultimate Performance Mode
In short, in CMD type…
powercfg -duplicatescheme e9a42b02-d5df-448d-aa00-03f14749eb61
…and press Enter.
Now when you check the available Power Plans, Ultimate is also visible. Try it if nothing else has worked.

 

[isen]

Has this always happened or did it start recently after a Windows update or something? If so you can potentially roll back to a restore point. I'm not much good with advice for Windows, but there are others here who may be able to suggest more software related things to try.

Hardware wise, first off you should disable XMP for your RAM, run it at defaults and see if that helps. If it does you may have to give a bump your DRAM or IMC/system agent voltage a touch over the XMP settings, I dont have any experience with Intel platforms after 7000 series so you might need to ask over at Toms Hardware for specific advice on that unless someone here has first hand knowledge. If playing with voltages worries you it may also work if you enable XMP and simply change the speed manually to 3200 in BIOS instead.


Its also possible a small bump in a CPU related voltage might help, I've had and seen systems stable under load that drop voltage down too low at idle causing instability, again Toms might be a better place for specifics on that.

If its not the RAM, to find out of its a USB issue remove all USB devices possible and see if it still happens. If not return them one by one until it does.

This started about a week or two ago, and I have no idea of the last time that I updated Windows before that, at least a month or two.

I disabled XMP in BIOS so that the CPU ran at base clock(3.6 GHz) and the RAM at 2666 MHz and couldn't even get past the login screen because it froze after I typed in my password and then went to blue screen. The times I did make it past the login screen it instantly went to blue screen. I turned the XMP profile back on and had no problem logging in to my pc. I have had the XMP profile for over a year and have never had a problem after turning it on but it now being more stable than default settings is a bit concerning.

I might try the USB device thing when I have the time.

 

[isen]

Check Reliability Monitor and/or Event Viewer for warning messages at the times the system dies—hopefully they'll point at whatever's failing.

Check in Device Manager for any yellow warning icons—expand each category so you see all the individual components.

Since it sounds like a power issue—system goes to sleep and won't wake up—it's worth trying each of the different Power Plans to see if things improve under any of them. It might be as simple as High Performance isn't turned on properly and a switch in and out of it will fix it.

Are you aware of the Ultimate Performance plan? It's suited to a high spec machine like yours, I run it on a much lower spec PC. Here's a quick video segment about it:
Ultimate Performance Mode
In short, in CMD type…
powercfg -duplicatescheme e9a42b02-d5df-448d-aa00-03f14749eb61
…and press Enter.
Now when you check the available Power Plans, Ultimate is also visible. Try it if nothing else has worked.

The Event Viewer only shows critical errors for the fact that the computer restarted without having been turned off properly first. The Reliability Monitor has for the past two weeks consistently shown critical events where Windows stopped working as well as asOELnch.exe(Norton process), svchost.exe_WpnUserService, Aac3572MbHal_x86.exe(ASUS process), SearchApp.exe and explorer.exe. QfinderPro.exe has also crashed a couple times but that program has crashed quite a bit for a few years without anything being impacted by it.

Device manager shows no warning icons in any of the categories.

I was not aware of the Ultimate Power Plan! Well at least the fact that it could be activated by a line of code in cmd... I will activate it and see if it solves my problem, otherwise I will switch back to High Performance which would be a part of the switch in and out that you mentioned.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

The fact it wont even boot at JEDEC RAM settings is not good. These are are supposed to be 100% guaranteed stable on every system. Your RAM kit isnt on the QVL list for that mobo either.

First clear CMOS and try the RAM without XMP again, sometimes the BIOS can get stuck at settings and mess up. Might be its trying to run the XMP timings at stock 1.2 voltage for example without displaying correctly what its doing.

If that doesnt help, try the RAM in the other pair of slots, and then one stick at a time on each slot.

Motherboard RAM slots, RAM sticks themselves, or CPU IMC (memory controller) might be having problems IMO, need to isolate which.

 

[Brian Boru]

I have no idea of the last time that I updated Windows before that

Unless you control it manually, it would have been June 8th or soon after—MS send 'em out 2nd Tuesday of every month.

 

[isen]

The fact it wont even boot at JEDEC RAM settings is not good. These are are supposed to be 100% guaranteed stable on every system. Your RAM kit isnt on the QVL list for that mobo either.

First clear CMOS and try the RAM without XMP again, sometimes the BIOS can get stuck at settings and mess up. Might be its trying to run the XMP timings at stock 1.2 voltage for example without displaying correctly what its doing.

If that doesnt help, try the RAM in the other pair of slots, and then one stick at a time on each slot.

Motherboard RAM slots, RAM sticks themselves, or CPU IMC (memory controller) might be having problems IMO, need to isolate which.

I reset the BIOS to default settings (but I changed a setting to enable CSM which I need in order to boot on the SSD I have Windows on) and I successfully logged into my computer without blue screens with XMP turned off! Even if I can run the computer on (mostly) default BIOS settings now the freezing is still there.

I took the liberty of launching the computer in Safe Mode with the "minimal" option checked and left it for half an hour, and came back to no freezing or any problem at all. Does that tell you anything?

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

If it's working in safe mode, its most likely software. Good news, glad resetting BIOS helped. I'd assumed you'd ruled out drivers as you seemed to know what you were talking about in your first post.

Now you need to figure out which driver, personally I'd be clean reinstalling GPU and motherboard chipset drivers first. As we're into software though @Brian Boru likely has better ideas then me

 

[isen]

If it's working in safe mode, its most likely software. Good news, glad resetting BIOS helped. I'd assumed you'd ruled out drivers as you seemed to know what you were talking about in your first post.

Now you need to figure out which driver, personally I'd be clean reinstalling GPU and motherboard chipset drivers first. As we're into software though @Brian Boru likely has better ideas then me

Sounds like a plan! I just have a few questions regarding the drivers:

On ASUS's website for downloads for my motherboard(https://rog.asus.com/se/motherboards/rog-strix/rog-strix-z390-f-gaming-model/helpdesk_download), what do I download? The one labeled "Chipset", "Firmware", "VGA Drivers"? All of them?
Same thing with the GPU (https://rog.asus.com/se/graphics-ca...ix-rtx2060-o6g-gaming-model/helpdesk_download), is it the VGA drivers I'm downloading?

Sorry if I'm asking a lot, I'm just very careful when it comes to this sort of stuff 😅

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Sounds like a plan! I just have a few questions regarding the drivers:

On ASUS's website for downloads for my motherboard(https://rog.asus.com/se/motherboards/rog-strix/rog-strix-z390-f-gaming-model/helpdesk_download), what do I download? The one labeled "Chipset", "Firmware", "VGA Drivers"? All of them?
Same thing with the GPU (https://rog.asus.com/se/graphics-ca...ix-rtx2060-o6g-gaming-model/helpdesk_download), is it the VGA drivers I'm downloading?
Lastly the CPU(https://downloadcenter.intel.com/pr...-i7-9700K-Processor-12M-Cache-up-to-4-90-GHz-), the one labeled "Intel® Graphics - Windows® 10 DCH Drivers" should be the one I download, right?

Sorry if I'm asking a lot, I'm just very careful when it comes to this sort of stuff 😅

I'd start with Just the chipset drivers from Asus, also you're going to want to unplug as much USB stuff as possible before you start, as I said in my first post if one of those is causing this it's best to find out first.

GPU drivers you can get direct from Nvidias website, don't bother with Asus. I'm on mobile and a bit busy but @Lutfij has a guide in his signature on how to do a clean install using DDU to make sure it's all clean.

No problem by the way, I'll try and answer when and if I can, someone else might have ideas as well

 

[Lutfij]

I'll just post here to let my signature space come up for the community!

 

[Brian Boru]

If you haven't done so, now would be a good time to image your C: drive since you have at least a working Safe Mode—it's always a good idea to image before updating drivers. Macrium Reflect is a good image program, if you need one—I use it to image every month before the regular Microsoft Updates.

Speaking of updating drivers, turn that off in Microsoft Update—you want to get updates from the original component source when possible. Also you don't want to update drivers every month, only when you have a clear need to. Drivers are some of the most 'bleeding edge' software in your PC, so keeping them stable should be a priority.

I might try the USB device thing when I have the time

If you didn't do this already, you should. You have a lot of USB stuff, so good chance something is glitchy or some couple are conflicting with each other. Start with the Corsair & Logitech suite software, since they're both likely to be trying to 'control' things and are probably most likely to conflict.

what do I download? The one labeled "Chipset", "Firmware", "VGA Drivers"? All of them?
Same thing with the GPU

As @Kaamos_Llama said, get the Chipset driver from Asus & the GPU from Nvidia.

Sorry if I'm asking a lot, I'm just very careful when it comes to this sort of stuff

It's a pleasure to deal with someone who provides good info, follows recommended actions, and provides good feedback

the switch in and out that you mentioned

I assume you tried that without any success?

 

[isen]

If you haven't done so, now would be a good time to image your C: drive since you have at least a working Safe Mode—it's always a good idea to image before updating drivers. Macrium Reflect is a good image program, if you need one—I use it to image every month before the regular Microsoft Updates.

Speaking of updating drivers, turn that off in Microsoft Update—you want to get updates from the original component source when possible. Also you don't want to update drivers every month, only when you have a clear need to. Drivers are some of the most 'bleeding edge' software in your PC, so keeping them stable should be a priority.


If you didn't do this already, you should. You have a lot of USB stuff, so good chance something is glitchy or some couple are conflicting with each other. Start with the Corsair & Logitech suite software, since they're both likely to be trying to 'control' things and are probably most likely to conflict.



As @Kaamos_Llama said, get the Chipset driver from Asus & the GPU from Nvidia.

It's a pleasure to deal with someone who provides good info, follows recommended actions, and provides good feedback


I assume you tried that without any success?

Ok so I did a bit of a combo and uninstalled the Corsair and Logitech Software, uninstalled my USB devices in the device manager and restarted my pc with a Logitech k839 living room keyboard plugged in(was the most generic keyboard that I found lying around). Left my computer for a while so that it would go idle and it still freezes.

And yes I switched back to the High Performance power plan after Ultimate Performance didn't do anything. Still freezing after idle.

The only drivers left that I can think of is the audio drivers. The ones I can find are "NVIDIA HD Audio Driver 1.3.38.60" and "Realtek Audio Drivers". But in device manager I can also find "Sonic Studio Audio Mixer", even though I uninstalled Sonic Studio 3(an ASUS program) from my computer after it continuously set itself as the default input and output audio device during seemingly random times.

Oh and about imaging my C: drive, how would I go about doing that (if you don't mind dropping a link to a tutorial or something)?

It's a pleasure to deal with someone who provides good info, follows recommended actions, and provides good feedback

😄

 

[Brian Boru]

imaging my C: drive, how would I go about doing that

These pages should get you going:

Installing Macrium Reflect - Knowledgebase 8.0 - Macrium Reflect Knowledgebase

knowledgebase.macrium.com

Macrium Reflect Quick Start - Knowledgebase 8.0 - Macrium Reflect Knowledgebase

knowledgebase.macrium.com

Creating a disk image of a single drive or partition - Knowledgebase 8.0 - Macrium Reflect Knowledgebase

knowledgebase.macrium.com

They also have a forum, if you need it:

Disk Imaging

forum.macrium.com

There are other software which do this, but many of us use Macrium, it's very good and very reliable while not being difficult.

it still freezes

Well that sucks. I'm out of ideas—uninstall the Sonic driver via Device Manager, and uninstall one of the other two if you don't use both.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

One more thing came to mind, I see youre using a SATA SSD, try a different data cable and/or port. I once had some weird behaviour with my rig, occasionally wouldn't boot and hanging at times on desktop. It turned out the SATA data cable somehow went bad as it was fine once I replaced it.

Also if youre using Norton AV I've heard people say that can cause freezes with a corrupted install, might be worth reinstalling that, or disabling it and trying another AV to see.

 

[isen]

Well that sucks. I'm out of ideas—uninstall the Sonic driver via Device Manager, and uninstall one of the other two if you don't use both.

One more thing came to mind, I see youre using a SATA SSD, try a different data cable and/or port. I once had some weird behaviour with my rig, occasionally wouldn't boot and hanging at times on desktop. It turned out the SATA data cable somehow went bad as it was fine once I replaced it.

Also if youre using Norton AV I've heard people say that can cause freezes with a corrupted install, might be worth reinstalling that, or disabling it and trying another AV to see.

I uninstalled the Sonic driver and the computer still froze. I changed SATA cable and port and it still froze. I even reinstalled Norton and it still froze. I restarted the computer after each of these events and it still froze.

But now, for some reason, one restart later, IT DOESN'T FREEZE AFTER IDLE! For the last three or four times the computer has went idle, it has worked as usual, it doesn't crash if I right click on the desktop right after it has been idle! I have even restarted the computer after each time it has been idle to recreate the scenario of the previous times it has crashed after idle(by which I mean turning on my computer and then just leaving it after logging in).

Absolutely no clue as to why it has decided to work now, but I want to thank you guys so much for the time and effort you have put into this! Was planning to reinstall Windows tomorrow but I guess there's no need for that now. THANK YOU!

 

[Brian Boru]

THANK YOU

Wonderful, long may it last!