Expensive computers and the reasoning behind it.

[RSV.]

Ok new guy here. I got a question for you? Why do computer players want or need the most expensive computers? Parts, 500 dollar keyboards. Etc.. A girl told me you by the cheap mechanical keyboard once then move up into the expensive price keyboards. Why? I will never pay 500 for a keyboard.

When I got my first ever computer. It was a Hubert Packard with a CD Rom burner. Almost 3000 dollars. Now I have a Dell, Laptop, I kept the Hubert Packard and a Cyberpower PC. The Cyberpower does 10 time more than I ever need. Under 700. I have owned it for a long time. It does more than any other computer I have ever owned. I have noticed a trend. Pre built is frowned upon any more and never good enough. And when I got my first computer I went to Game Spy. Classic Gaming ,com. We downloaded games. I do not anymore. That was stealing. But I never knew it.

Back then 1999 you upgrade the graphics card to a Voodoo and mabey 1 other thing? You got a set of nice speakers etc.. I never grew up with a computer. I used a Tandy and IBM in elementary school. I studied and old Apple 2 in middle school. I did not take computer in high school. Why? I was addicted to games. And I wanted to get away from that. To be less addictive to games. I thought I would want the PC for games only.

Then the internet came. 2 people and myself taught me the computer. I am mostly self taught. So when did the gaming PC become a thing with the glass on the side? I noticed one on the web once at Game Spot. 10,000 dollars. I said no way I will pay that. Now like flat screens. portable DVD players etc.. they are so cheap.Now I have expensive speakers I got at a discount store. Nice stuff. But when did it become a thing to overclocked you systems?

And why are most pre built and my brand of choice frowned upon? I also now have a old Commodore used. I like old PC's. So when did the changing you parts every 5 moths become a thing? I brought up my brand on a Facebook club and said it was a fantastic value to people. One day I could no longer find the club. Turned out I was banned and did not know it? I guess they hate my brand and pre built in general? That happened a very long time ago.

Seems like you cannot discuss this topic in general at some places. So thanks for the reply.

 

[Colif]

Why do computer players want or need the most expensive computers? Parts, 500 dollar keyboards. Etc.. A girl told me you by the cheap mechanical keyboard once then move up into the expensive price keyboards. Why? I will never pay 500 for a keyboard.

Perhaps they see it as an introduction to what could be. Entry level keyboards are great for people that are happy with them. Other people like features you won't find on cheap ones. Latest trick is digital key switches that can replicate controllers so you don't need to have two different controls to play some games. That and custom keyboards let you choose what keycaps you use or what switches are inside them or how much sound dampening foam is inside to make them quieter. They let you make the keyboard your own. They not all that expensive either.

Back then 1999 you upgrade the graphics card to a Voodoo and mabey 1 other thing? You got a set of nice speakers etc.. I never grew up with a computer. I used a Tandy and IBM in elementary school. I studied and old Apple 2 in middle school. I did not take computer in high school. Why? I was addicted to games. And I wanted to get away from that. To be less addictive to games. I thought I would want the PC for games only.

I didn't take computing for opposite reason. It was all business related and I was more interested in games. So I mainly ignored it for 20 years until got 1st PC in 1999.

So when did the gaming PC become a thing with the glass on the side?

In the last 8 years or so, Before that you could find some cases with plexiglass sides but Tempered Glass cases are a new thing. Not exactly sure when first "gaming" PC was made, the "gaming" label is just a way to increase prices... same applies to RGB as well. Gaming PC need to be flashing kaleidoscopes that when turned on dim lights in rest of the street. So distracting you can't see monitor...

And why are most pre built and my brand of choice frowned upon? I

A lot of people see it as cheaper to make the PC yourself, and it lets you pick what parts go in. Some of us are picky about parts. Want to know they good before they go into PC. OEM PC tend to be made from generic parts that aren't bought for their quality but how many they can get in bulk. Not all of them are like this but enough to make people consider making it themselves. Its also way easier to make them now compared to 20 years ago

And why are most pre built and my brand of choice frowned upon? I also now have a old Commodore used. I like old PC's. So when did the changing you parts every 5 moths become a thing?

The percentage of people who need to live on the cutting edge is small. Most people don't upgrade every 5 months, as (like I assume you said) you don't get value for money. I only upgrade entire PC once every 5 years or so... not worth it before then. Some people do it less often than I do. There is no right way...Early in the 2000's I had a few PC in quick succession and then made one last me 8 years. Average is about 4 years now.

Only people who upgrade every 5 months or so are:

1. Youtube hardware reviewers
2. People who follow the above
3. Rich people who have nothing else to spend money on
4. Idiots

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

Ok new guy here. I got a question for you? Why do computer players want or need the most expensive computers? Parts, 500 dollar keyboards. Etc.. A girl told me you by the cheap mechanical keyboard once then move up into the expensive price keyboards. Why? I will never pay 500 for a keyboard.

When I got my first ever computer. It was a Hubert Packard with a CD Rom burner. Almost 3000 dollars. Now I have a Dell, Laptop, I kept the Hubert Packard and a Cyberpower PC. The Cyberpower does 10 time more than I ever need. Under 700. I have owned it for a long time. It does more than any other computer I have ever owned. I have noticed a trend. Pre built is frowned upon any more and never good enough. And when I got my first computer I went to Game Spy. Classic Gaming ,com. We downloaded games. I do not anymore. That was stealing. But I never knew it.

Back then 1999 you upgrade the graphics card to a Voodoo and mabey 1 other thing? You got a set of nice speakers etc.. I never grew up with a computer. I used a Tandy and IBM in elementary school. I studied and old Apple 2 in middle school. I did not take computer in high school. Why? I was addicted to games. And I wanted to get away from that. To be less addictive to games. I thought I would want the PC for games only.

Then the internet came. 2 people and myself taught me the computer. I am mostly self taught. So when did the gaming PC become a thing with the glass on the side? I noticed one on the web once at Game Spot. 10,000 dollars. I said no way I will pay that. Now like flat screens. portable DVD players etc.. they are so cheap.Now I have expensive speakers I got at a discount store. Nice stuff. But when did it become a thing to overclocked you systems?

And why are most pre built and my brand of choice frowned upon? I also now have a old Commodore used. I like old PC's. So when did the changing you parts every 5 moths become a thing? I brought up my brand on a Facebook club and said it was a fantastic value to people. One day I could no longer find the club. Turned out I was banned and did not know it? I guess they hate my brand and pre built in general? That happened a very long time ago.

Seems like you cannot discuss this topic in general at some places. So thanks for the reply.

There are decent reasons why some prebuilts are frowned upon, but some people tend to take it to far and theres nothing wrong with getting a good pre built machine. The power supply is the usual big reason, they often arent of high quality and so wont last much beyond a 3 year warranty by design. They want you to buy another one asap.

Overclocking is really either for show or for world records these days. Used to be you could overclock a part and have it perform the same as a much more expensive version. Now boost algorithms in the processors make it a matter of 10% at best in some scenarios for daily use.

I upgrade something most years, because its one of my hobbies. At the same time I dont understand why people spend more than 10k on a car, its just a boring functional thing to get you from a to b, and you cant legally go beyond the speed limit anyway, so whats the point?

 

[Colif]

When I said "upgrade every 5 months" I mean entire PC... not just one part or two.

I am always thinking what next I could add, but right now there isn't anything I really need.

 

[Kaamos_Llama]

We'd have to define what a need is better but I totally get that. I should say overclocking is also kind of fun if you are interested in hardware, and underclocking is a great way of making your rig use less power and therefore create less heat too.

But @RSV. , theres a whole range of PC gamers who arent interested in hardware at all, and some who obsess over it. I wouldnt worry to much about hardware snobbery. If your system makes you happy, good for you.

 

[Colif]

We'd have to define what a need is better

Something that is essential for the PC to keep working. I more or less replaced everything last year so need is something I hope not to encounter this year. Want is another ssd but I don't need it.
If something broke I would need to replace it.

 

[Alm]

I have a £1500 PC. I spent that much because PC gaming is my favourite hobby and the only thing I really like splashing out on. I think the £8000 PCs are just for extremely rich people so it's not too common.

 

[Frindis]

I prefer to buy a PC from companies that specialize in giving you the ability to adjust the components/price than buying something that is mostly set in stone for you like you get with DELL or similar companies. I went to a DELL site just to check what you could do and compared to the company I use (Komplett) there are very few options to adjust the prebuilt PCs.

As for upgrading my PC, I don't feel the need for it. I am perfectly fine having a mid-range PC and if I need to squeeze out some more FPS, I'll just be more smart about adjusting the settings and finding a good middle ground between performance and quality.

As I see it most PCs that cost over 10K are either some fancy customed themed ones or you are buying a workstation and not a gaming PC which would also be incredibly overkill for just gaming.

 

[Brian Boru]

£8000 PCs are just for extremely rich people

Yep, if you got lots of cash, spend it how you want.

most PCs that cost over 10K … you are buying a workstation

This.

The big thing for me is building what I need, which differs from what you need. I work & play on my PC, so I need reliability first with performance second. I've saved money and heat by getting a CPU which doesn't have integrated graphics [Xeon] or overclocking ability in the past. Graphics is far more important than audio, so spend on GPU & skimp on audio.

I'm a big awkward lump who's paranoid about heat, so a large case for working in with good airflow is necessary. All that said, current PC is a Dell prebuilt—been rock solid since 2017, but gives me hives when I open it, horrible interior design for DIY.

 

[Colif]

I've saved money and heat by getting a CPU which doesn't have integrated graphics [Xeon]

Ryzen CPU never had igpu in them... so Intel followed the idea, now the latest Ryzen do have igpu in them. It doesn't effect the cost. No idea about heat as they not meant to be used for anything other than basics. If you want to actually use the igpu, you would get an 8000 series APU.

Dell not made for self repairs. They make it impossible to reuse some parts. They also still trying to use cases from 20 years ago, with plastic stuck on them to make them look hip. It doesn't work once you open them up.

$AUD 5k is pretty easy to do... just swap the GPU in my PC for a 4090 and you suddenly on $5712... only really adds 1400 to price.
Change my case to a Silverstone Alta F2... $938 more... still only 6650.
Without putting a stupid number of nvme in PC its not really easy to get to 10k (I am sure you can, I am not trying very hard).

 

[Brian Boru]

Ryzen CPU never had igpu in them... so Intel followed the idea

No, Xeon launched ~20 years before Ryzen. You're probably talking about some recent version, whereas I was talking about 10-15 years ago when I was still doing small hosting for a bunch of small sites—Xeon was the CPU in the shared servers I used. Designed for low power & heat, plus long-lasting reliability, and cheaper than equivalent consumer grade at the time—so an easy choice for my own build at the time.

Dell not made for self repairs.

For sure—unfortunately I 'inherited' current PC, so stuck with it. But rock solid as said, and I don't plan to upgrade anything, so all good for as long as it lasts.

 

[COLGeek]

Hewlett Packard?

Sorry, I'll show myself to the door...

 

[RSV.]

Hewlett Packard?

Sorry, I'll show myself to the door...

A spelling mistake thanks for the heads up.

 

[mjs warlord]

My first pc was a packard bell back in 2003 it cost £850 and the monitor was a flat screen that was only just entering the market , hence its high price of £500 , the entire package with printer and scanner was £1600 and way back then was considered a crazy amount to spend and one guy even said why do you want a hard drive as big as 60GB ..... how times have changed....

I have not bought an off the shelf pc for almost 10 years because when ready made pc's need upgrading they can turn into a money pit.

My games rig is 8 years old and cost £3,500 it has a gtx 1080 that had just entered the market place , the card can handle almost anything i throw at it and i can use games that players with silly price cards are struggling with.

With regards to why gamers spend silly money on pc's their are many reasons for this , a lot of games writers use top of the range gear to write games so it follows that games players also have to buy the best kit they can afford . Their comes a point where you have no choice but to upgrade or replace what you have got because their will be a lot of games that you wont be able to use.

Their are a lot of games that are now being written or upgraded to unreal engine 5 and a typical example of this is SATISFACTORY , this has been upgraded to unreal 5 and the minimum spec to run the game has now changed , a lot of unhappy players with low end pc's are complaining they can no longer use the game.

Whenever i get a new pc i keep my previous one to use as a test rig , if i download something onto it and i have a problem i dont put it on my new pc.

 

[DXCHASE]

And why are most pre built and my brand of choice frowned upon?

The thing is, this isnt really a thing anymore imo and people saying that pre-builts suck over building it yourself dont know how to find a good value or solve computer issues when they come up.

I say this because i have 2 pre-builts in my house and have had 0 issues with both of them and they have both been through the ringer. Its also, for me, easier to finance. Is my computer self built? Absolutely, but im the big game nerd in the house. My son and wife (gamers too) play, but they dont need the type of build i do since i play almost 100x what they do.

There was a time where building your PC yourself could save you 2-400 or so rather than paying that for the service of building a pc and shipping it to you but nowadays, thats not the case and i mostly blame the rising cost of gpus and silicon in general.

and one guy even said why do you want a hard drive as big as 60GB ..... how times have changed....

its funny you mention this because i vividly remember having conversations with pc gamers in the mid 2000s (2006ish) that went to my college and they were talking like big budget pc games were gonna be smaller with more packed into them! I would always argue this against them.

 

[RSV.]

The thing is, this isnt really a thing anymore imo and people saying that pre-builts suck over building it yourself dont know how to find a good value or solve computer issues when they come up.

I say this because i have 2 pre-builts in my house and have had 0 issues with both of them and they have both been through the ringer. Its also, for me, easier to finance. Is my computer self built? Absolutely, but im the big game nerd in the house. My son and wife (gamers too) play, but they dont need the type of build i do since i play almost 100x what they do.

There was a time where building your PC yourself could save you 2-400 or so rather than paying that for the service of building a pc and shipping it to you but nowadays, thats not the case and i mostly blame the rising cost of gpus and silicon in general.




its funny you mention this because i vividly remember having conversations with pc gamers in the mid 2000s (2006ish) that went to my college and they were talking like big budget pc games were gonna be smaller with more packed into them! I would always argue this against them.

Thanks for the answer. Most on Facebook clubs will not allow any discussions like this. They will ban you, delete the thread and call you a troll. My first computer was almost 3000 dollars. But my Cyberpower PC cost less and does more than I will ever need.

My first pc was a packard bell back in 2003 it cost £850 and the monitor was a flat screen that was only just entering the market , hence its high price of £500 , the entire package with printer and scanner was £1600 and way back then was considered a crazy amount to spend and one guy even said why do you want a hard drive as big as 60GB ..... how times have changed....

I have not bought an off the shelf pc for almost 10 years because when ready made pc's need upgrading they can turn into a money pit.

My games rig is 8 years old and cost £3,500 it has a gtx 1080 that had just entered the market place , the card can handle almost anything i throw at it and i can use games that players with silly price cards are struggling with.

With regards to why gamers spend silly money on pc's their are many reasons for this , a lot of games writers use top of the range gear to write games so it follows that games players also have to buy the best kit they can afford . Their comes a point where you have no choice but to upgrade or replace what you have got because their will be a lot of games that you wont be able to use.

Their are a lot of games that are now being written or upgraded to unreal engine 5 and a typical example of this is SATISFACTORY , this has been upgraded to unreal 5 and the minimum spec to run the game has now changed , a lot of unhappy players with low end pc's are complaining they can no longer use the game.

Whenever i get a new pc i keep my previous one to use as a test rig , if i download something onto it and i have a problem i dont put it on my new pc.

When I see people upgrade every 5 months or want and buy the very best. Or push blinding one yourselves they say pre built is not good enough. Water pipes running through their PC. Water coolant, one had pinto beans going through his? And they are just average computer players. They cry when the next person shows their PC speed and theirs is not as fast.

I guess I just do not understand it? If it plays 98 percent of games very well then why do they want very best or most expensive anyways? And refuse pre built or cheaper options? It is their personal preference.

And I like forums better than Facebook anyways. We can talk about almost anything without be judged or ridiculed for our opinion. And you do come to the forum one day and cannot find it. One Facebook they will ban you and not tell you about it either. You just cannot find the club you always talked at about certain subjects.

Like expensive keyboards at Best Buy. I never understand it, My mechanical Keyboards, rolled up and fold up and membrane keyboards work just as good. My computer mouses work great. Gaming mousse's too. Wireless mouse. I cannot use headsets. My tinnitus from the electric guitars I own is driving me crazy. I hear no ringing. I hear really loud air hose, radio static, white noise etc..

I own a LG wide screen. Love it. No Linus The Tech Tips 700 dollars screen. And if my computer can run 90 percent of games withs no issue fine. I can always upgrade it later.

 

[Brian Boru]

one had pinto beans going through his?

Uh, what?

 

[mjs warlord]

RSV ... i read what you said about tinitus , i have had this for over 20 years , it is the high pitched version like yours , not the low rumble of an old lorry version. On a bad day it can effect my balance . DONT let anyone talk you into paying for a so called cure because their is no cure , a specialist says it could just vanish tomorrow or be with me for the rest of my life.

A few years ago i went to a guys house and for some reason he was messing around with a sound generator program on the internet , when it hit a certain pitch i felt as if i had been punched in the side of my head and almost fell over. I told him to stop but no he carried. Do it again and i unplug you pc without turning it off ..... I guess you can figure out what happened next ...... i just said i told you so.

 

[RSV.]

Uh, what?

I saw it myself. Beans. They asked why? Then I looked up water coolant. I was shocked what was in a gaming PC. Really? That is overkill in my opinion.

 

[RSV.]

Perhaps they see it as an introduction to what could be. Entry level keyboards are great for people that are happy with them. Other people like features you won't find on cheap ones. Latest trick is digital key switches that can replicate controllers so you don't need to have two different controls to play some games. That and custom keyboards let you choose what keycaps you use or what switches are inside them or how much sound dampening foam is inside to make them quieter. They let you make the keyboard your own. They not all that expensive either.


I didn't take computing for opposite reason. It was all business related and I was more interested in games. So I mainly ignored it for 20 years until got 1st PC in 1999.


In the last 8 years or so, Before that you could find some cases with plexiglass sides but Tempered Glass cases are a new thing. Not exactly sure when first "gaming" PC was made, the "gaming" label is just a way to increase prices... same applies to RGB as well. Gaming PC need to be flashing kaleidoscopes that when turned on dim lights in rest of the street. So distracting you can't see monitor...


A lot of people see it as cheaper to make the PC yourself, and it lets you pick what parts go in. Some of us are picky about parts. Want to know they good before they go into PC. OEM PC tend to be made from generic parts that aren't bought for their quality but how many they can get in bulk. Not all of them are like this but enough to make people consider making it themselves. Its also way easier to make them now compared to 20 years ago

The percentage of people who need to live on the cutting edge is small. Most people don't upgrade every 5 months, as (like I assume you said) you don't get value for money. I only upgrade entire PC once every 5 years or so... not worth it before then. Some people do it less often than I do. There is no right way...Early in the 2000's I had a few PC in quick succession and then made one last me 8 years. Average is about 4 years now.

Only people who upgrade every 5 months or so are:

1. Youtube hardware reviewers
2. People who follow the above
3. Rich people who have nothing else to spend money on
4. Idiots

A guy talking about computers I read tonight said he got his sister something at Best Buy. They are none of the good enough. But she just uses the internet. Candy crush, word processor etc.. None of them good enough?

From some strange reason they want the most expensive, and to over clock their systems etc.. So when I first got mine expensive first PC we used it as is. You could upgrade the graphics card to VooDoo. But I think that was about it?

Now if they want 1000 dollar keyboards, 900 dollars for 1 part on the inside of the gaming PC etc.. to each their own. In my opinion they are computers that are good enough or do more like mine family bought me. I am going on 49 years old. It does 10 times more than I need. And if a part goes out I will replace it.

Now any tips on how to clean the dust out of it? I got small paint brushes for cleaning my electric guitars etc.. What else would you recommend?

 

[Colif]

My first PC needed one upgrade to be useful. A Voodoo 2 card... it was a start. i clearly wasn't happy with it as I made a new one just a year or so later.

we are all different so what we are happy with in computers is different as well. I am happy with mine now but then I replaced almost all of it last year and the only parts that are more than 16 months old now are:

• Motherboard
• Ram
• Nvme
• cables...
• case

I won't replace any of those until I need a new PC, or if one dies prematurely.

Now any tips on how to clean the dust out of it? I got small paint brushes for cleaning my electric guitars etc.. What else would you recommend?

OPOLAR Battery Operated Air Duster

1. Deep Cleaning & Extensive Utilization: This OPOLAR duster tops the market by its capacity to produce a powerful thrust of air at almost 9 levels strong gale for deep cleaning of the microscopic dust of 0.9-1.1oz. Starting from printed circuit boards to electronic instruments, medical devices...

www.opolar.com

I have one of those. Works well.

I used to use a paint brush to clean my PC but that is much easier.

 

[Brian Boru]

tips on how to clean the dust out of it?

My main tip is to prevent it getting in/on in the first place
I built my desk from an old door and 4x4s, one specific requirement being long enough that it could hold my PC on it. No pets shedding hair in the room, no kids rushing thru raising dust, etc. I open it up once a year for a look, but there's never much to do.

For whatever needs doing, I use a car vacuum which can suck or blow, and a can of compressed air.

 

[Colif]

Opened mine for first time in four months a few hours ago, not really that much dust showing on PSU shroud. Only other flat surface is top of GPU and it looks pretty clean too

its not spotless but I have seen worse.

having it off the ground does seem to help, if nothing else it lets it breath fresh air up there. Mine always lives on a box

it gets fresh air before I do.

It helps almost all new cases have filters you can remove and clean. that stops most of the dust getting into intakes.

 

[Brian Boru]

it gets fresh air before I do.

No wonder you're always so chirpy and upbeat—you're breathing in air from the fancy graphics card exhaust!

having it off the ground does seem to help,

Essential if floor is carpet or rug, or there's much foot traffic to keep floor-level dust swirling. Even a foot off floor helps.

 

[Colif]

My room is too small for the PC to be on the floor and get a good supply of cool air. It would get boxed in by my bed or other furniture.

Box was more useful on my old PC as its only intakes were on the bottom along the side of case... none on front or back

lucky the space air got in was raised off ground in that case, as it wasn't always on the box... as you can see. But later in its life it was.

i don't really miss that case... as its still in my room. Perhaps I should let go... but it was the last case I knew I wanted before PC. Its hard to let go.

BTW, 49 makes you young around here. Don't assume we all young people... most of them don't use forums (that isn't aimed at Brian, he wishes he was 49)